In this episode of Living in the Meantime, Stephen Bauman sits down with Holly Fogle to explore a remarkable journey—from partner at McKinsey & Company to co-founder of Nido de Esperanza, a groundbreaking program supporting mothers and babies in Washington Heights.

Holly shares the moment she realized her life’s work needed to change, the disorienting loss of identity that followed, and how a deep spiritual calling led her toward a radically different vision of impact—one rooted not in solving problems, but in building community.

Together, Stephen and Holly unpack what’s been lost as communal life has eroded in modern culture—and what it might look like to rebuild it. They explore the power of radical hospitality, the dignity of truly “seeing” others, and why meaningful change often begins with small, local, deeply human connections.

From launching a program that stays with families for three years, to responding to crisis during COVID, to expanding into national direct-cash support through the Bridge Project, this conversation offers a compelling vision for how faith, community, and action can intersect in transformative ways.

Chapters:

00:00:00 – Introduction & Holly’s Journey

00:03:00 – Leaving Success Behind & Losing Identity

00:06:00 – Faith, Calling, and the Search for Meaning

00:08:00 – The Vision: From Idea to Nido de Esperanza

00:12:00 – A New Model: Community Over Problem-Solving

00:16:00 – Challenges, Critiques, and Listening First

00:20:00 – Why Community Works (and Why People Stay)

00:23:30 – Immigration, Invisibility, and Human Dignity

00:30:00 – Expanding Impact: The Bridge Project & Systemic Change

00:36:30 – Rebuilding Community & A Call to Action

In this episode, Stephen Bauman reflects on the rise of performative beauty culture and makes the case for something deeper: a daily commitment to “soulmaxxing,” and reclaiming what truly makes us human.

Transcript:I recently learned about an emerging online community called looksmaxxing, and its emergent 20-year-old star who goes by the name, Clavicular. Looksmaxxers believe that male attractiveness is the key to worldly achievement, and every step toward increasing their beauty to be virtuous. But as the New York Times reports, it’s a certain kind of beauty, as identified by Clavicular, akin to actor Matt Bomer: lantern-jawed, symmetrical and white. That’s the ideal. Again, according to the Times, Clavicular has well over a million followers on Tik Tok and Kick, rakes in $100,000 a month and often spends 8 hours a day live streaming.

This strikes me as the inevitable apotheosis of where social media has been headed for a long while...the extreme end goal of the narcissistic performative presence stripped to its barest essence, exalted as the only essential human value. Checking out a couple of interviews, what’s revealed is a sad and empty human vessel jacked up on arrogant self-regard. Its breath-taking, really, and wouldn’t require a lot of analysis except for how looksmaxxing has evidently captured the attention of many susceptible young men who’ve lost connection with meaningful human community. On the surface it’s not overtly political or ideological, but seriously devoid of any engagement with things that really matter. A hollowing out of what it means to be a human fully alive.

I don’t need to go on and on with this, but Monday morning I did wind up in a conversation about it with my 30-something trainer at my local gym. Catching my breath while moving from squats to bench press, I asked Teddy if he had heard of Clavicular... He said that he had just been talking about him and the whole looksmaxxing phenomenon with a friend, who thought that what Clavicular could really use was some soulmaxxing. They had a good laugh about that, but it struck me they had landed on something important. They meant it for fun, but they nailed it perfectly.

I’m thinking soulmaxxing is exactly what we could use more of these days--serious engaged commitment to honoring the higher values of our humanity. The cultural rot has seeped far and wide beyond the boundaries of its more extreme examples. We’ve all been touched and tempted by the downward tug of our lessor natures. In our current environment it takes focused attention not to succumb and then to actively choose a better way. With eyes wide open we discover these opportunities arrive every single day. A daily opportunity for soulmaxxing...

Transcript:

It’s a beautiful spring day here in the Hudson Valley--fostering an appropriate-seeming post-Easter feeling--hopeful, affirming of renewal. And that feeling is accompanied by the chorus of awakening peepers. For you city folks that’s the music of the small chorus frog, scientific name, pseudacris crucifer--crucifer meaning cross-bearing, a reference to a pattern naturally inscribed on each one. Each frog, a cross-bearer. That their song suddenly pops up in the season of Easter has been likened to an expression of resurrection. That works for me. That’s the spirit of the moment I’m in.

Which, I confess, contrasts dramatically with the libretto our president offered Easter morning laced with expletives, threats and taunting sarcasm. Is it worth repeating? Maybe not. But I’m thinking we shouldn’t forget it either. “Tuesday will be Power Plant Day, and Bridge Day, all wrapped up in one, in Iran. There will be nothing like it!!! Open the F------ Strait, you crazy b******s, or you’ll be living in Hell - JUST WATCH! Praise be to Allah.” That he walked back the wild threat yesterday does not erase the impact of its content and timing. Utterly bewildering. Thank God I have the music of chorus frogs on a beautiful spring day to keep me on track with what matters most.

But now stay with me here, because what came to mind from out of left field was a study I read concerning human competency. Not surprisingly researchers discovered that persons who are deemed incompetent by a reasonable standard to not believe that they are. They rate themselves as quite capable. In other words, incompetent people don’t know that they’re incompetent and probably won’t believe it if you tell them. That’s one of the marks of incompetence. Let your focus wander for a moment over our current public landscape to see if anyone comes to mind...

But as you do that, don’t wait too long to remember that all of us have our relative strengths and weaknesses and blindnesses; that the trick to living in the real world is to be as objective as we can about this. “Know thyself” is the maxim inscribed upon the Temple of Apollo in ancient Greece, meaning, that understanding oneself is essential for wisdom and personal growth, underscoring the importance of self-awareness, recognizing one’s limits and abilities. The people I have most admired over the years are constant learners. They have not believed they had it all or knew it all. Some have had quite of lot of power, some have not. What they have all shared was the humility to see what was true, especially--to the best of their ability--what was true about themselves.

So, here’s where that leaves me today: attempting to hold several massively contrasting things simultaneously -- a chorus of cross-bearing peepers celebrating the possibility of resurrection on a beautiful spring day; the bewildering, incompetent diatribe of our President; and the sustaining awareness that I owe it to myself, to those I love and to the community at large to renew my commitment to honoring what is true and real.

This episode explores honesty, accountability, and the quiet but urgent work of reclaiming integrity—in our public life and in our own.

TRANSCRIPT:

The story goes that addressing a crowd during the Civil War, Abraham Lincoln was asked why he didn’t just declare the slaves to be free and be done with it. Lincoln replied by asking the crowd, “If I told you that a lamb’s tail was a leg, how many legs would a lamb have?” “Five,” came the answer: “No, four,” said Lincoln. “Calling a tail a leg doesn’t make it one.”

This little parable has been haunting me for months and sounds especially naive today given how our political class has flipped Lincoln’s perspective upside down, aggressively insisting, “Don’t be ridiculous! Of course there’s such a thing as a five-legged lamb!” The lies and misrepresentations have been coming at us at a bewildering pace, deforming our cultural and political expectations for fact-based truth-telling. That’s why Lincoln seems so wildly old-fashioned in his sensibilities. In his day everyone would have found his pithy story quite humorous given the obvious moral. Today it falls flat, sounding sadly irrelevant to current conditions.

If ever there was a cause for profound cynicism for the state of things, this life-threatening allergy for candor and accountability makes a strong case. Asserting lies and cover-ups as Truth (capital “T”) never changes their essential nature. Another old aphorism comes to mind here--it goes like this: “Truth comes as conqueror only to those who do not receive it as a friend.” Most of us learn this the hard way at some point in our lives--hopefully on the early side. We discover for instance, that an enduring, loving, and trusting relationship cannot be sustained with half-truths and BS. And what’s true for us in healthy relationships is equally true in healthy democracy, which is why I’m willing to accept the label of “hopelessly naive” in wondering if we’ll be able to work our way back to Lincoln.

Epic Fury

We’ve been hearing a lot from generals and other armed services officers in recent months. They mostly engage geo-political debates and tactical operations concerning the pros and cons of the deployment of our military. You likely have a strongly held point of view about our current operation called Epic Fury in Iran. I know I do. But as a kind of counterpoint to today’s chaos, I came across this observation from General Omar Bradley of World War II fame and America’s first Chairman of the Joints Chief of Staff. With a crisp, blunt assessment in 1948, just a few years following the Hiroshima devastation, he noted that, “The world has achieved brilliance without wisdom, power without conscience. Ours is a world of nuclear giants and ethical infants.” Could we amend that last sentence today by adding AI gods with nuclear giants and ethical infants??

Now I don’t know if General Bradley had in mind his own nation as well as others, but I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt that he did, because every truly wise person I’ve ever known has their wisdom grounded in humility. Wisdom and humility always show up together. Wise persons have a bead on their own weaknesses and vulnerabilities as well as their strengths. And they call them out.

We now say that the United States is the only real superpower left on the world stage, that our military and economy have no equal. We know that in the realm of manifest power we are strong. We have bombs and ships and planes and drones galore, as well as the almighty dollar! But when it comes to wisdom, conscience and ethics, organically rooted in humility--wow, that’s in very short supply. In fact, it seems the temper of the moment is the exact opposite of humility--arrogant, officious, discriminatory.

As usual though, I like to bring my observations down to earth in our own local geographies, wherever they happen to be. It’s extremely easy to get caught up in angry finger-pointing algorithms that wind up deflecting us from quietly considering our own lives and behaviors--as in, my posturing and preening in my own environments of work, home and community.

This kind of authentic self-awareness doesn’t keep us from active engagement with our cultural/political moment. No, we owe it to all that we highly value to defend our democracy and promote the common good, but... in the meantime, holding ourselves accountable in the manner we seek to hold our politicians and generals, honoring our strengths by owning our weakness and vulnerability.

The wisdom of the nation has its roots embedded within the commitments of its citizens like you and me.

BUY THE BOOK HERENew York Times Article

Chapters:

00:00:00 Welcome + introducing Homeschooled and Stefan Merrill Block

00:04:20 “A semester” becomes four-and-a-half years of isolation

00:07:10 “Unschooling,” genius narratives, and family division

00:10:20 Loneliness, reading, and writing as survival

00:13:00 Is it abuse? Tenderness, ambivalence, and reader validation

00:20:10 Anger, fear, and the cost of “betrayal” at home

00:22:40 Bleached hair, peroxide, and the theater of control

00:24:55 Crawling for months: the episode readers can’t forget

00:35:45 Homeschooling laws, oversight failures, and reform

00:46:20 Returning to high school and building a life afterward

Zooming in for a closer look we discover this privileged network is comprised of an unusual cluster of otherwise unnatural friends--boundary-crossing bedfellows--who would normally congregate by sharing a similar walk of life, or occupation, or political identity etc. These Epstein perps are a wildly diverse mix. Indeed, it seems the transgressive, rule-breaking norms actively fuel the intoxicating draw for those who longingly beyond the entrance gate. What’s the price of admission, I wonder; what groveling or salivating behavior unlocks the door; which set of blinders must one wear? And what alluring awards await at each membership level?

But, you know, it’s easy for those on the outside to wallow in another sort of intoxicating behavior-- the moral superiority kind, which is not to say there’s no judgement and accountability to be made here. On the contrary, it’s long overdue. The victim survivors have been awaiting justice for decades! But there are several lesson layers in this morality tale for the brave of heart, running the gamut from a question like, “What the hell kind of elite have we spawned in our capitalist democracy?” to, “How have we been complicit with the encroaching cultural decrepitude we’re all witnessing?” Ultimately leading to a more personal inventory of our own choices, behaviors and associations, because, friends, that’s honestly where the real paydirt sits in the meantime... in the soil of our own lives, in what we actually do versus what we might say we believe...

At the time, Stephen admits, he was far more like the cocky politician than the humble student. But over the years, the lesson settled in: you cannot take in what is new, true, or wise if you are already full of yourself.

In today’s political and cultural climate, that ancient insight feels almost foreign. Is there still space for humility among our leaders? Is there even an appetite for wisdom? Or have we become so saturated with opinion, outrage, and algorithm-fed certainty that we’ve lost the capacity to empty our cup?

In this episode, Stephen reflects on humility as a civic and spiritual discipline. He names the pull of tech-saturated media, the shredding of shared values, and the temptation to be swallowed whole by cynicism or fear. Yet he insists we still have agency. We can keep faith with truth. We can practice compassion. We can choose resilient courage and recommit to the common good.

Rebuilding our common life won’t happen through spectacle or online performance. It will happen brick by brick—through embodied community, kindness instead of cruelty, and the quiet, countercultural act of emptying our cup.

Living in the meantime requires nothing less.

Transcript:

Many years ago, while still in graduate school, I heard theologian Henri Nouwen tell the story of a politician, who, in a moment of rare self-awareness, decided to visit a Zen master to ask for wisdom in how he might govern. Nan-in, the Zen master, served him tea. He poured his visitor’s cup full and then just kept on pouring. The politician watched the cup overflow until he could no longer restrain himself. “It’s overflowing, Nan-in. The cup cannot hold any more.” “Like this cup,” Nan-in said, “you are full of your own opinions and attitudes. How can I teach you anything unless you first empty your cup?” At the time, I was a cocky young stand-in for the politician, but the lesson lodged somewhere in the back of my mind. It took a while for the cockiness to subside enough to let Nan-in’s wisdom gradually seep into full consciousness and by then I had confirmed the hard way, this basic law of personal physics, which predicts you can’t take in something new if you’re already full of yourself. Pithy bit of wisdom that requires constant renewal for those with the heart for it.

But honestly, the political/cultural environment has evolved so dramatically, Nouwen’s little parable today seems a quaintly irrelevant story from an alternate universe. You mean to say there was a time when the politicians and potentates had even a little itch to learn something new? A place where the tiniest shred of humility sparked a desire for wisdom on how best to serve the greater good? An actual country where politicians and capitalists would entertain emptying their cup for the sake of growing into wiser, humbler versions of themselves? That would really be something!

The trick for those of us striving to keep our wits living in the meantime today--in the universe we actually inhabit--involves holding fast to our deepest values especially as we witness their shredding within the political and cultural elites captured by a tech-saturated media seeking to swallow us up whole. Some days it feels like we’re hanging on for dear life from getting sucked into the dark void. But it’s really important--necessary--we remind ourselves we have agency for keeping faith with basic things, with basic human goodness--like, simple truth (keeping faith with truth), compassion for all persons, resilient courage, and a passionate regard for the common good. We saw these things recently modeled in Minneapolis. As these next weeks and months unfold, we’ll likely need to look to ourselves for modeling behavior as we re-center attention on our better angels. We can do this. We need to do this. It’s so important to join with other people--in the flesh--and not just online. To touch one another, reaching out compassionately, practicing kindness in lieu of cruelty, and when called upon, sacrificing comfort. These are very basic things we can do. Thoughtfully rebuilding the structures of our common life one brick at a time.

00:03:10 – Why this moment feels different—and why it matters

00:06:05 – Algorithms, outrage, and the collapse of shared reality

00:09:40 – Filters, bias, and learning to truly listen

00:12:35 – Vietnam, Watergate, and earlier eras of national distrust

00:16:20 – Institutions: why we can’t live without them—and must rebuild them

00:19:50 – Apathy, disengagement, and the cost of checking out

00:23:40 – Tribalism, social media, and losing real conversation

00:27:55 – Love as the antidote to fear and anger

00:32:45 – Small acts, shared spaces, and living our values out loud

Set in 1906, Ragtime captures a nation cracking open into something new, where beauty and heartbreak exist side by side. But it wasn’t just the performance that lingered—it was a passage from the playbill, reminding audiences that sitting together, listening to a shared story, is itself a quietly revolutionary act. Turning off our devices. Paying attention. Looking to our left and our right. Remembering that we belong to one another.

Against the backdrop of cultural chaos and algorithm-driven distraction, Stephen explores how small, embodied choices—presence, kindness, shared attention, commitment to the common good—take on outsized significance. Not a top-down solution, but a bottom-up reclamation of what it means to be human.

In a fractured time, this episode is an invitation to stay human, stay present, and keep reminding one another that these seemingly small acts still matter.—————————————————

Manuscript:

Ragtime

Melissa and I had planned a theater immersion in New York City last weekend... and likely you can guess that most of it got snowed out, but not before we managed to squeeze in fabulous matinee performance of Ragtime at Lincoln Center. Among other things, Ragtime is about the beauty and the heartbreak that are fused together during those times when our world is cracking open into something new. The year was 1906, a raucous time when America was changing into a new version of itself, with so many opportunities as our country moved forward coupled with so very much pain in that struggle. It was an excellent production... and considering current conditions, a timely revival of a classic Broadway show. Go see it if you can. Terrific cast, best singing I’ve heard on Broadway in a long while. And in the playbill, there was an unusual welcome written by Lear deBessonet, the new Artistic Director of the Lincoln Center Theater. Here’s the last paragraph of what she wrote: “In the last 120 years, we have felt tectonic cultural shifts time and again. Every generation, every person, has its own version of their Ragtime year. As we sit on the cusp of America’s 250th year as a nation, there are few things that feel so quietly revolutionary as sitting in a room together listening to a story. And yet, it’s deeply human--to sit in congregation with one another and share in these tales reminds us that we are never alone. Alongside the 41 actors on the stage and 28 musicians, there are also dozens of crew and staff, those 1000 audience members, and the eight million New Yorkers beyond. We are all part of this ragged yet awe-inspiring fabric. Look to your left, look to your right. I am so happy that you are here.”

That I read that on the same day as the events unfolding in Minneapolis felt jarringly serendipitous to me. That to really see and hear the actors, musicians, technicians along with the fully engaged members of the audience, to consider the story unfolding on the stage, required everyone turning off their electronics, and paying attention to the in-person human dynamics. It was the humanness and humaneness of the experience that suggests an antidote to our current cultural chaos. I know, it seems such a small intervention to stay focused on what it means to be human-- engaged with actual physical people, intentional in compassionate acts of kindness, alert to and participating in a politics that advances the cause of the common good-- to look to the left and the right walking along the street instead of down into an electronic rabbit hole of amplified algorithms. But these small choices take on a revolutionary character today. That’s not a top-down agenda, but a bottom-up reclamation of the perennial values at the heart of our humanity. And I’ll continue to repeat that we need to remind and support one another in this over and over.

Sitting with King’s insistence on conscience over convenience, Stephen invites listeners into the harder work of honest seeing—of making a clear-eyed assessment of what is, even when it’s uncomfortable. Avoidance is tempting; clarity requires humility, intention, and community. This episode is a call to shared courage: to help one another see truthfully, to stand where conscience leads, and to choose fidelity to the common good in a time of challenge and controversy.

Don’t deflect. Don’t pretend you have no role to play. Don’t look away.

Manuscript:

Don’t look away...

This week began with our nation’s annual remembrance of Martin Luther King, Jr. But there’ve been so many hot distractions and AI slop clogging our attention, his day came and went without much notice. Which seems especially unfortunate considering the focus of his work--the reclamation of the promise enshrined in the Declaration of Independence and clarified in the blood of the Civil War that all persons are created equal, endowed with unalienable rights like life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Man! does that seem to fall on deaf ears today given the raucous, violent discontent in current conditions. Like you, I’m upset, confounded and distracted by pummeling news feeds and algorithms. To cope, I turn tech off, take long walks, refresh my spirit, open my heart and mind, yearning for a greater wisdom.

As my own personal discipline, I revisited some of what King said, re-tasted what authentic inspiring leadership looks, sounds and feels like. And in that, I heard the call to bravely assess our situation today. To take a clear-eyed look. I know from experience that’s actually a very hard mission for most of us, much of time--to make an honest-to-gosh searching assessment of what is--to really see it, to get it. That requires a humble intentional commitment--an honest, searching assessment of what is, to see it as clearly as possible. And you likely know very well that we can beat around the bush forever in a state of convenient avoidance of the truth most days. Can’t recount the times I’ve witnessed this when working with people over the years and disturbed to discover this tendency in myself.

For my part I’ve been sitting with two related sentences from King’s writings.

The first: “There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politic, nor popular, but he must take it because conscience tells him it is right.”

And the second follows right along: “The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy.” Which begs the question: where am I standing today?

I have these quotes in a corner of my screen where I can’t avoid them. I so want to really see what’s going on in our culture and politics... and I need compassionate friends to help me with that. We need each other... to help us see clearly, and then to stand firm in what our conscience tells us what’s right, to stand tall on the side of truth, of our common good, in this time of challenge and controversy. The life of Martin Luther King Jr. provides a model for this sort of collective courage. Don’t deflect, don’t pretend you have no role to play. Don’t look away. Faith, hope and love reside in joining our hearts and hands in this critical moment.

Drawing on the wisdom of the ancient world, including Cicero’s conviction that nothing is more noble than fidelity, Stephen contrasts that vision with our present moment, where fame and power seem to eclipse faithfulness as guiding ideals. And yet, he suggests, it’s difficult to imagine a life of real depth or meaning that isn’t rooted in a commitment to truth and integrity.

This episode invites listeners to slow down and consider a challenging choice: if you had to choose just one—fame, power, or faithfulness—which would you pursue, and why?

Drawing on Harry Emerson Fosdick’s striking image of rowing toward Niagara Falls while debating whether to stop at Buffalo, Stephen names a difficult truth: life does not pause for our indecision. The river keeps moving. And over time, our hesitation itself becomes a choice—with real consequences.

This episode is a gentle but clear-eyed invitation to courage in the new year: to move beyond watching life drift by and instead step into it with intention, even when certainty is impossible.

Shahinda shares the beauty and ache of celebrating “three Christmases” in Bethlehem, the reality of permits and checkpoints, and what it feels like to be treated like a stranger in your own homeland. She reflects on the vanishing Christian presence in the Holy Land, the importance of interfaith community between Christians and Muslims, and why pilgrimages that “visit the stones” must also engage the living people of the land.

The conversation closes with a hopeful, grounded invitation: to listen to local voices, to learn the lived reality behind the holy sites, and to support education as a path toward dignity and staying rooted—especially through the mission of Bethlehem University.

Chapters:00:00:00 — Welcome + Introducing Shahinda Nassar (Bethlehem University)

00:00:54 — Epiphany, Orthodox Christmas Eve, and “Three Christmases” in Bethlehem

00:02:26 — Shahinda’s story: Jerusalem, Beit Sahour, and life beside holy places

00:04:20 — “Life here is hard”: celebrating Christmas amid war and grief

00:05:38 — The vanishing Christian presence in the Holy Land

00:08:17 — Settlers, occupation, and misconceptions about Bethlehem and Palestinians

00:13:16 — Permits, magnetic cards, and the daily restrictions on movement

00:21:02 — First family visit to Jerusalem: checkpoints, fear, and sacred longing

00:28:28 — “Visit the living stones”: pilgrimage, solidarity, and being seen

00:35:12 — Muslim-Christian community, raising children, and why Bethlehem University matters

We’re strangely unaware that simple disciplines of attention to these various conditions can restore the experience of balance to a remarkable degree. Given we’re on the cusp of a new year and you likely could use a fresh take on things, why not jot these four words on a sticky note--physical, mental, emotional and spiritual--and place it where you’ll see it each day as a reminder... Maybe the bathroom mirror or computer screen. Exercise this small discipline and you’ll be surprised how soon they become second nature and hard to forget.

And friends, may hope, love and gratitude, abound for you in this new year.

Marcella shares the ongoing story of her parish’s partnership with a local Afghan refugee family—and the urgent work to support Ali, detained by ICE despite a routine asylum process. From there, the conversation widens into Advent as a season of “unveiling,” how churches can become rare spaces for shared civic life amid deep disagreement, and why some boundaries (especially around harm and exclusion) matter. They also discuss technology and AI—why Marcella opts out whenever possible—and how we cultivate real community for children in a screen-saturated age. The episode closes with a bracing, non-Pollyanna vision of Christmas hope: not optimism, but a communal practice of carrying light through dark times.

10 chapters

00:00:00 — Welcome + why a Christmas conversation with Rev. Marcella Gillis

00:01:39 — Marcella introduces herself: priesthood, partnership, and becoming a new mom

00:04:08 — Christ the King’s “food + discipleship” identity and the Afghan refugee dinner

00:05:20 — Ali’s detention: what happened, what’s being done, and the emotional toll

00:08:39 — From powerlessness to participation: living your values locally (and together)

00:11:18 — “Advent as unveiling”: a paradigm shift, privilege, and destabilized institutions

00:15:26 — Pastoring honestly: prophecy vs. care, and how congregations hear what they’re ready for

00:19:16 — Interfaith solidarity: shared values, different words, and complicated traditions

00:30:42 — AI, integrity, environment, and community: why Marcella opts out—and why it matters for kids

00:41:21 — Christmas hope without optimism: the “unkillable” love that’s practiced in community

Right as Stephen feels himself tipping toward a public meltdown, an unexpected stranger steps in—calm, tender, and strangely prophetic—offering a simple reminder that cuts through the commercial frenzy: none of this is the reason for the season. In this short reflective episode, Stephen explores how a small moment of kindness can feel like an angel in disguise—and how remembering what’s real can change everything, even in the middle of the madness.

To stay connected, visit stephenbauman.com for links to follow, subscribe, and more about Steve’s work, including Gaining Clarity. Subscribe on Substack for early episodes and extra reflections, and find the show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever you listen.

Stephen suggests that beneath our awkwardness with love lies a deeper fear—that we are not fully worthy of it ourselves, and therefore hesitant to offer it freely to others. And yet, the paradox at the heart of love is this: it is not a scarce resource. The more generously and appropriately it is given, the more it grows.

A quiet meditation on vulnerability, generosity, and the strange human resistance to learning what love has always been trying to teach us.

Together, Stephen, Mark, and producer Brandon dig into the hidden human and environmental costs of generative AI: from mental-health crises and parasocial “relationships” with chatbots to massive data centers that devour electricity and water while citizens foot the bill. They name the religious language and fantasy behind transhumanism, the lure of power in Silicon Valley, and the temptation to treat our devices as modern idols.

Amid all this, the conversation keeps circling back to the heart of Living in the Meantime: how do we live as fully human, relational, grounded people in a tech-saturated world? Mark offers practical ways to reset our relationship with our phones, seek out healthier communities, and “look to the helpers” who are building humane alternatives—while Stephen connects it all to the ancient warnings against idolatry and the call to authentic, compassionate life together.

Chapters 00:00:00 — Introducing Mark Hurst: Friendship, Career, and Tectonic

00:02:00 — From Optimistic Technologist to Big Tech Critic

\00:04:37 — What AI Actually Is: Clearing the Fog

00:08:23 — The Hidden Human Costs of Generative AI

00:11:48 — Environmental Consequences: Power, Water, and Data Centers

00:15:01 — Economic and Political Manipulation Behind AI Expansion

00:20:05 — The Mythology of AI: Hype, Hope, and Harm

00:26:15 — Living with AI: Boundaries, Search Engines, and Agency

00:30:36 — Finding the Helpers: Real Community in a Digital Age

00:35:46 — Tech as Modern Idolatry & Returning to Human Flourishing

00:01:10 — Who is Jared? From New Hampshire to Jerusalem

00:02:20 — A search for Jewish identity becomes a lifelong home

00:04:30 — Learning the land: history, religion, neighbors

00:05:55 — Seeing Israel-Palestine as shared space

00:07:10 — Jewish learning, teaching, and interfaith encounters

00:08:35 — Raising a family in Jerusalem

00:09:50 — Military service, choice, and identity

00:12:00 — The ethics and tensions of mandatory service

00:15:20 — Judaism, peace, and challenging the tradition

00:17:10 — Constructive disagreement (Machloket)

00:20:15 — What “religious” means in Israel

00:21:50 — October 7th: trauma, shock, and national grief

00:23:45 — Holding both Israeli and Palestinian suffering

00:25:50 — Work shuts down; volunteering begins

00:28:00 — Teaching abroad and finding purpose

00:29:30 — Why education and activism matter more than ever

00:32:20 — Being an outlier in Israeli society

00:34:00 — Raising children toward peace

00:36:00 — Faith, identity, and generational shifts

00:37:20 — The current reality in the West Bank

00:39:40 — Restrictions, fear, and rising violence

00:41:10 — “Are you hopeful?” — Jared’s answer

00:44:15 — Resilience, community, and sacred texts

00:47:20 — Teaching in the U.S. and returning home

00:50:00 — Organizations doing real peace-building work

00:55:20 — Closing reflections: gratitude & the season of light

00:57:10 — Farewell and next steps

Chapters:

00:00:00 — A Thanksgiving Memory Resurfaces

00:00:28 — Meeting David on the City Bus

00:01:05 — A Moment of Listening That Mattered

00:01:32 — David Finds Clarity

00:01:55 — An Unexpected Visit of Gratitude

00:02:18 — Stephen’s Own Awakening

00:02:40 — The Call to Offer Thanks

You can buy Steven’s Book HERE

Chapters00:00:00 — Welcome & today’s guest: Steven Poskanzer00:01:16 — Who is Steve? Lawyer, scholar, 20 years a college president00:02:57 — Back to the classroom: teaching constitutional law00:04:17 — New book: The University’s Voice and why it matters00:05:53 — “Fidelity and focus”: mission as a decision filter00:07:46 — Making room for reflection: what the academy can still do00:08:24 — Are universities succeeding? A candid yes (with caveats)00:09:47 — The long view: anti-intellectualism & populist cycles00:11:03 — Disruption by design: research, new ideas, creative friction00:18:58 — Classroom culture: can unpopular ideas get a fair hearing?00:21:28 — Indoctrination vs. education: peer correction and standards00:22:18 — Free speech on campus: who gets a mic—and why00:24:30 — Brandon jumps in: debate culture and false equivalence00:24:45 — Context matters: street politics vs. seminar rules00:26:01 — Civility as a tool for thinking (and its misuses)00:28:23 — Crisis of curation: when every “fact” looks equal00:31:39 — Peer review & replication: authenticating knowledge00:33:44 — AI as super-curator? Power, risk, and validation00:46:39 — Who needs college? Value without credential worship00:50:19 — Regulation, pace, and the iPhone lesson of AI00:41:58 — When should institutions speak? Academic freedom & funding00:43:28 — Case studies: teaching bans, affirmative action, DACA00:45:17 — Collective voice: ACE, AAU, and informal coalitions00:53:35 — Final word: trust, knowledge, and why universities still matter

Chapters

00:00:00 — Why This Space Exists

00:00:40 — The Perennial Things That Matter

00:01:25 — A Subway Story About Civility

00:03:15 — Paying Attention to Simple Truths

00:03:50 — Coming Soon: Long-form Conversations

He reminds us that the vitality of any city — its cleanliness, civility, and integrity — mirrors the collective will of its people. As election season approaches, he calls us to remember our shared responsibility in shaping the communities we inhabit.

A meditation on belonging, civic duty, and the sacred hum of everyday life.

Chapters

00:00:00 — Life in Manhattan Begins00:01:05 — The Noise of the City

00:02:15 — A Garbage Truck and a Moment of Clarity

00:03:10 — The Shared Life of a City

00:03:45 — A Call to the Ballot Box

Chapters:

00:00:00 – Introduction: A Vigil in the Hudson Valley

00:01:30 – The Story of Ali Far-Kirzada

00:03:00 – Community Hospitality and the Common Good

00:05:00 – The Power of Collective Care

00:06:30 – From Words to Action: Living What We Say We Believe

Chapters:

00:00:00 – Opening Reflection: “What You Do Screams So Loud”

00:01:10 – The Emerson Quote That Stuck

00:02:35 – Becoming a Father and the Shock of Responsibility

00:04:15 – Actions Speak Louder Than Words (Especially to Children)

00:06:00 – Performative Culture and the Illusion of Doing

00:08:10 – Embodied Character in a Disembodied World

00:09:00 – Closing Thoughts

In the debut episode of Living in the Meantime, Rev. Dr. Stephen Bauman sits down with producer Brandon Batson to introduce the heart behind this new podcast and blog project. Together, they explore what it means to live lives of deep meaning and value amid chaos, uncertainty, and cultural change.

From reflections on retirement and rediscovering purpose to navigating the overwhelm of a 24/7 information world, Stephen shares how the phrase “living in the meantime” came to him as both a personal and cultural calling — a reminder to find grounding and grace in ordinary days, small acts, and authentic community.

This opening conversation sets the stage for the podcast’s ongoing journey: one that invites listeners to slow down, reflect deeply, and re-engage with the world and one another in meaningful, compassionate ways.

00:00:00 – Introduction

00:01:06 – Why “Living in the Meantime”?

00:03:17 – Life After Retirement

00:06:11 – The Awakening Moment

00:07:32 – Making Meaning in Chaos

00:09:07 – The Power of Daily Living

00:10:22 – Conversation as Connection

00:11:54 – Who Is This For?

00:14:41 – Perennial Values and Honest Struggle

00:16:55 – Stories that Inspire

00:19:46 – Building Community and Engaging Difference

00:21:39 – The Need for Human Community

00:24:37 – Practices for Living in the Meantime

00:28:41 – Closing Reflections