Since then, congressional hearings in 2022 and 2023 have featured current and former military and intelligence officials alleging that the U.S. government—and potentially other nations—has maintained a long-running crash-retrieval and reverse-engineering program involving recovered craft and so-called “biologics.” While these claims remain unverified and are the subject of ongoing investigation, their entry into formal governmental proceedings marks a significant cultural shift in how the phenomenon is publicly discussed.

This mounting series of disclosures and the brave efforts of whistleblowers to make them possible are covered in the remarkable documentary film ‘The Age of Disclosure’.

In this groundbreaking SENSESPACE dialogue on the topic of UAP I bring together veteran journalist Matthew Green who has been tracking the UAP phenomenon in depth for years, and Layman Pascal, philosopher and writer, who’s ‘9th Quadrant’ essay demonstrates some of the most advanced engagement with this multi-dimensional phenomenon I’ve come across.

Why haven’t journalists fully integrated the UAP story despite years of sworn testimony before the U.S. Senate?

How legitimate is the UAP phenomena and do Matthew and Layman ‘believe’ it is real?

How logical would a program of government suppression be given the destabilising impacts of disclosure?Together we journey into this terrain. Considering how we can make sense of it and what an evolution of journalism might look like in this context. We explore the possibile necessity for para and extra-institutional 'councils' to engage extra-dimensional phenomena. We consider UAP in the context of a larger sea-change in our sense of the real alongside AI singularity, psychedelic renaissance, christian revival and more.Finally, if no amount of disclosure is enough to really ground this strangeness in our day to day awareness what is being asked of us? And what kind of consciousness must emerge for these phenomena to truly “land” in our awareness?

Watch on Youtube

Speakers

Matthew Green is a journalist, collective healing facilitator, and author with over a decade reporting globally for major news outlets before moving into integrative cultural work. He co-hosts dialogues on trauma, healing, and cultural transformation, drawing on his training in collective trauma integration and projects like Resonant World and What is Collective Healing?. He is a co-founder and facilitator of The Resonant Man Initiative.

Jacob Kishere is a philosopher, writer, rapper, and dialogue facilitator. Creator and host of SENSESPACE, his work traverses insight, wisdom, healing, and cultural complexity. He co-founded The Resonant Man and develops live events and dialogue spaces that explore collective evolution, ontology, and embodied meaning-making.www.jacobkishere.comLayman Pascal was incarnated on a remote island in the Pacific Northwest. He used to be a meditation teacher, yoga instructor & public speaker—but he’s feeling much better now. He is a writer on themes of cultural philosophy, shamanism and organic spiritual development.www.laymanpascal.substack.com/

We explore:

* Christian revival and ‘Christendom’ thinking

* Walking a path of sacred pluralism

* Christianity as both colonial and liberatory

* The power of ‘the word’ and the Christ event

* Atheism’s relation to death

* The musicality of being and divine resonance

* Tensions and dialogue with Islam

* Gender, Masculinity & Islam

* Church, Initiatory Spaces & Psychedelic Christianity

Watch Now:

Chapters:5:20 Emerging Christic movements, Christendom and Western decline7:00 Jacob’s journey in/out of Christianity, EUROTAS, peyote10:11 Matthew on Jesus’ non-violent ministry 13:40 Healing Christianity-indigenous relations15:10 Christianity as bringing a liberatory message17:56 Non-evangelism, concrete universality & pluralism20:41 The already-done Cosmic Christ event24:51 The impact of Atheist perspectives on death37:39 Musicality of life & divine resonance40:49 Islam and the West57:34 Dialogue with Islam1:07:00 Islam & the West as mirror to men & women1:18 Reclaiming indigenousness1:20 Church vs. initiatory ceremony (Buddha, Dharma, Sangha)1:29:40 Matt reflects on 20 years of YouTube philosophy

Our previous dialogue:This is the second dialogue in the series, following our first exploration which launched this series in Oct 2024:

Notes:Matthew’s Substack ☿ Footnotes2Plato ☼☽ More from Jacob:www.jacobkishere.comSENSESPACE’s Intro theme comes from our friend Coryayo’s cosmic medicine music.

Our intention is to give men who are seriously considering joining the initiative time to experience the work and the field we’ve been cultivating before deciding whether to commit further as paid members.

Spaces will be allocated on a first come, first served basis. Participants will also be invited to join a WhatsApp group where we continue our dialogues between sessions.

Our weekly circle is a campfire where men can gather in the knowledge that they’re stepping into a supportive field of peers who are ready to witness them deeply in their struggles, questions and breakthroughs. Feedback is only offered when invited, and we recognise the value of moments of silence for allowing new insights to emerge, and deeper wisdom to be felt.

This is a high-value offer for men who are interested in

* Intergenerational dialogue

* Accountability and mutual support to achieve goals and establish daily practices

* Evolving monthly themes

* A space of sacred pluralism for authentic seekers

* Understanding ancestral, personal and collective healing

* Regular guest facilitators

* Sincerity and humor

If you’re keen to experience The Resonant Man, get in touch below or reply to this thread and we’ll arrange an introductory call. We look forward to meeting you.

Practicalities:

When: Sundays, 19:00 UK time /

Where: Zoom

What’s Required to Participate:

* Book an Introductory Call with Matthew and Jacob to answer any questions and see if it’s a good fit.

* Review our basic commitments in the Code of Honour.

* You’re ready to go

Regular Membership:

Membership of the Resonant Man is £125/month and includes participation in our WhatsApp group. There is no obligation to continue beyond your initial month’s commitment. We make this work as accessible as possible and concessions are available.

Welcoming Guest Facilitator: O.G. Rose

On Sunday 23 November we’ll welcome O.G. Rose, philosopher and author of Belonging Again. Daniel (O.G.) is a longtime friend of the initiative who has played an instrumental role in fostering philosophical fellowship and context for The Resonant Man.

He, with his co-writer and wife Michelle, is a poet, a philosopher, homesteader, father and American. We’re looking forward to his absolutely unique form of dialogue which brings to life the necessity of philosophy, dialogue, resonance and really thinking the age that we live in.

“We desire relationships with the quality of resonance because they show us what it really means to be together. The tragedy today is that we often don’t know what we’re missing out on—layers of resonance are lost or never even discovered.

The Resonant Man is working to explore and cultivate this, recognising that it is through resonance that our relationships can foster intimacy, healing, dynamism, and much more. And, that practicing resonance is how we do the work of realizing this vast unrealised potential.

Our much discussed Meaning Crisis is a Crisis of Resonance—a lack of a particular experience of flow, connection, and losing oneself that changes the meaning and possibility of the whole of life.”

I had a strong intuition to bring together Jonathan and Stephen for the first time on SENSESPACE to share in their affinity for the walk of wisdom, the richness of Tokien’s Lord of The Rings and the call to Pilgrimage.

Both Jonathan and Stephen recently undertook the Camino de Santiago and represent to me a certain kind of Englishmen that have retained the sense of enchantment that runs through our culture back to the works of Tolkien. Enjoy the dialogue with us.

About The Speakers:

Jonathan Woodbridge is currently on his ‘wise Re-enhantment’ pilgrimage and for the section of the journey is volunteering in the monastic community of Taizé. His deep roots and love is the soil of Sussex, England. His current life-work is focused on what John Vervaeke called the ‘Advent of the Sacred’ and investigating what it means to midwife this wisely.Stephen Winter is the author of ‘Wisdom from The Lord of The Rings’, a weekly publication. He lives in Tolkien’s Shire, the county of Worcestershire in the heart of England. The farm where his aunt lived, known to the locals as Bag End, is just a few miles from our cottage, and if you took away modern roads and telegraph poles, the countryside around here won’t have changed much in a hundred years. Stephen was a parish priest in the Church of England for 36 years before retiring in 2024 and now he is writing about Wisdom from The Lord of the Rings (you will find his blog by typing those words into your search engine) and making his cottage as much a homely house as he can for travellers on the road who might stop by.Stephen’s publication: Wisdom from The Lord of The Rings

Jacob Kishere is a professional dialogue facilitator, writer, rapper, and philosopher living in Ciudad de Oaxaca, México. He is the am the creator of SENSESPACE Podcast & SENSESPACE Studio: A live events and podcast production suite. He is the author of Culturepilgrim Substack & Rap Music and co-founder of The Resonant Man: an international men’s initiative gathering every Sunday.www.jacobkishere.com

The talk brings listeners alongside in my pilgrimage through philosophy, healing and the direct experiences that re-awoke the flame of Christ in my psyche.

I introduce my transformative project: Christianity Beyond Itself. Discussing some of its key principles including the trinitarian flow between Christianity, Philosophy and Plant Medicine and the distinction between a Christianity of “Arrival” versus “Journey.” I also explore what Dialogos is and its key role in transformative intercultural mediation.

Chapters:

2:00 Intro & Meditation

7:08 Jacob’s Christian Upbringing

10:33 Encountering Mushrooms

12:52 Self-Sacrifice

15:00 Dark Night of the Soul & Christ

17:40 Ayahuasca, The Art of Release, Jordan Bates

19:14 Introducing Christianity Beyond Itself

20:33 The Trinity of Christianity, Plant Medicine & Philosophy

23:11 A Christianity of Arrival vs. Journey

28:42 Mary & The Divine Mother

32:00 What is Dialogos

39:26 Talking to Christians About Plant Medicine

57:32 Building a Sacred Ecology of Practice

In March 2025 I journeyed to Nihue Rao in Iquitos Peru for my most significant ‘diet’ with the Plant Medicine of Ayahuasca to date. The retreat was held by Maestro Remi Delaune, and his Shipibo teacher Maestro Ricardo Amaringo. I first experienced Remi’s works at ‘Kumankaya’ the remarkable healing center he and his wife Ashley built in the jungle of México. As a curandero he brings a one of a kind mixture of presence, humor, devotion to the medicine and indescribable Icaros.

His near 20 years as an Orthodox monk in France and transition to a deep study of Shipibo Ayahuasca medicine make him a unique teacher on the experiential, mystical and synergistic integration of Christianity and Plant Medicine. Remi’s work represents a key inspiration for my ongoing project ‘Christianity Beyond Itself’.

We recorded this impromptu interview exploring what Ayahuasca is and and Remi’s understanding of the relationship between Ayahuasca, Christianity and the Shipibo tradition. He shares the key practices of the Curandero, the idea of a ‘natural pentecost’ and the importance of a strong spiritual practice when approaching ayahuasca and why he is not an emissary of the plant.

*A note on audio fidelity*

This podcast was recorded in the open air at Nihue Rao in Iquitos Peru. There are lots of wonderful bird sounds. However, there was also some construction on site which shows up for a couple of minutes. These noisy moments have been included to preserve clarity and meaning in the dialogue.

“If you go into the core of it then you’re going to understand the Christianism has just begun, because nobody is capable of matching the level of spirituality of love, of service, of sacrifice that is required to be a true disciple of christ. And the Shipibos they don’t teach anything else than that; humility, love and service, being caring for people—that’s what they teach.

So for myself I do believe that christianity is teaching what true human beings should be. St Irene de de Lyon, a father of the church from the 2nd century, was saying “the glory of god is a living man” you understand? Living to the fullest his life, in the presence of God. His freedom to the fullest, in the presence of God.”

—Maestro Remi Delaune

Chapters:

3:30 Why do we drink Ayahuasca

08:00 What is the Icaro?

15:29 The relationship between Shipibo Ayahuasca tradition and Christianity

16:50-19:32 construction sound

19:52 Remi’s background in Greek Orthodox and mystical experience

20:42 Deepening Christianity through Ayahuasca

24:19 A ‘natural pentecost’ rather than a psychedelic renaissance

25:43 Ayahuasca is not for everyone

27:30 It’s important to have a spiritual practice when we engage with ayahuasca

28:00 The Five points that make a good Curandero

What I’m distilling here is the essence of my project, Christianity Beyond Itself: that Christ is not only about the liberation of the heart, as many Christians recognize, but also the liberation of the mind. Christ dissolves the boundaries between the heart and the mind.

At the core of the challenge in modern Christianity is that it teaches how to liberate the heart but not the mind. This is what Christianity Beyond Itself seeks to address, and it does so in two core ways:

* Bringing the transformative dialogue practice of Dialogos to the heart of Christian culture. This is a practice in which each side engages in profoundly deep listening and is receptive to a mutual transformation and evolution of their ideas—learning to tap into a field of wisdom that is available in reality itself.

* The integration of plant medicine with Christianity. Plant medicines play an essential role in dissolving the boundaries of the mind, bringing a more expansive Christ consciousness. Equally, they support the healing of fragmentations and ancestral blockages that we hold collectively as trauma.

I started my journey as a young intellectual considering the crisis of the modern West in relation to Islam. My undergraduate and master's theses both centered on the problem of ‘Islam and the West’ and what we needed to understand to address that.

I believe the project of Christianity Beyond Itself is the central response to that crisis—both in relation to pluralism, which, as O.G. Rose demonstrates in Belonging Again, is an inevitable and inescapable condition, and in relation to ‘the meaning crisis’ as articulated by John Vervaeke.

Christianity Beyond Itself is a ‘deep vibe’ that is synergistic with Vervaeke’s notion of the philosophical Silk Road—a space in culture, fostered by Dialogos, in which wisdom can be exchanged across traditions, and transformative encounter and mediation can occur between religions. Christianity Beyond Itself is the Christian side of the philosophical Silk Road.

This project is key to the evolution of Western culture, which cannot branch into its next phase without rooting down into its own deeply Christian (and pre-Christian) architecture. As moderns, we are like a plant alienated from its own soil, trying to grow with shallow roots.

Individually and collectively, I encounter many Western people who are blocked from the wisdom of the Christ-heart and their own heritage due to their unprocessed Christianity trauma. As a result, we float in a ‘spiritual but not religious’ mindset that lacks civilization-building substance. We act out inverted and sublimated Christianity through pathologized modern ideologies. We go looking for wisdom everywhere but in our own lineage. We rob ourselves of the rituals of birth and death, and the depth of connection with the divine that makes all things possible and conquers death.

Christianity Beyond Itself builds on an understanding and sensitivity to the deep trauma that many carry—both from the shadow of the church, in relation to the collective of the church community, and the deep trauma of alienation from God. There is no Christianity Beyond Itself without Christianity Acknowledging Itself. We can make this possible through a devotion to the process of collective healing and an ongoing quest to dynamically integrate and mediate the full scope of psychotechnologies available in Christianity, other religions, philosophy, indigenous wisdom and plant medicine.

—

I really enjoyed the Realisation Festival and think you may too. It will take place this June in Dorset, U.K. and tickets are now available.

You can hear the full interview with Mark Vernon here, I hope I can return the favour Mark on SENSESPACE to further this conversation.

Today I experienced something I have not for a long time; a real workout. It was a great breakthrough and, like many others, it grew out of frustration. For all the talk between Hannah and I in recent days and weeks about buying bicycles or an exercise machine nothing had happened—we were both desperate for exercise. It’s that palpable feeling of not having had any real exercise in 2 months. Hannah was taking a rest day after a poor nights sleep but for the life of me I couldn’t join her to relax in bed. I was restless. The demands of the future had me alert, growing with SenseSpace and launching my dialogic practice was dogging my mind. In such moments of not knowing what to do I’ve learned to seek a creative channel but none seemed to avail me this time.

I took a healthy hit of cannabis and quickly became more aware of my body. Dropping onto the mat whilst Hannah lay in bed I started stretching and doing the usual Asanas but it wasn’t enough. A certain manic insatiable energy had me. “I’m going to train the stairs” I announced, proceeding out to step my way up the 5 flights in our apartment building. It was a few ascents, two steps at at time, before I began to really feel something. No sweat yet but a hint of blood flow, a light burning activation in the lungs and chest. Descending the steps I was drawn out into the Hinterhaus where I stood looking at the trees, swinging my arms and elbows to my knees as I felt the cool, wintry air against my lightly covered body. Wanting more I grabbed my body warmer and headed out — first walking, then breaking into a run. As I took stride running the perimeter of Boxhagener park around the corner life began to flow. People were bustling and I was running through clouds of reefer as people enjoyed the early spring sunlight around the park.

As I ran, some part of my past self was returning. I recollected memories from the two years 2017-2019 that I had finished my bachelors and Masters. Back then my experimental and regular practice of smoking before morning yoga classes and HIITS in the gym had left me beaming and enlivened. I would walk out of there in the sun (and cold) with my chest broad, feeling activated, feeling myself as I walked down Mile End road to my flat. During that time I had also been living in a complex and challenging relationship which, at my study’s conclusion, left me in an existential burnout and grappling with trauma. Sometimes the good memories get concealed amidst the process. Truthfully at that time I did look at myself in the mirror every time I got back from the gym, but damn I felt good and I felt driven. Without the exercise and my meditation practice I wouldn’t have been able to hit those long library sessions or the remarkable academic success that I did during that time.

Today I was feeling f*****g good and in my masculine body energy in a way that I hadn’t for a long time. As spring looms a beautiful future awaits. I intend to seize it.

As I left my street, I chose in an instant to head off at a right angle from my destination towards a park a few blocks away. This time, unlike previous trips to the supermarket, I was prepared. In the newly snow heaped urban wild I set out for an adventure. With each step across Warschauer Strasse the suchness of the moment grew, and with it the faintly dawning sense that I was stepping once more into a new chapter. My relationship with Hannah was entering a new phase, one of life commitment. As I walked along my heart was struck by a newly familiar sight; children riding snow sleighs pulled along by their parents. I felt an insight into this, the magic of the child’s life and the care of the journey weathered adult willing to pull them along on this cold night.

Today I got lost on familiar streets and I fell in love with it. I want this love of life, of adventure, to flow into every part of my world. Today I confronted my fears about brokeness and money to really embrace where I was. To be fuelled, to live a life so rich in joy and insight that I could be a person worthy of finding wealth and worldly value in what I offer. I welcome change to wash over me like the snow transforming the trees outside our windows into a quiet winter wonderland. As I plod along a growing sense in all my Englishness that I really was in the East. In the flurry of the snow memories stirred of a boyhood fascination with the battle of Berlin and the war in the east. It felt to me for the first time palpable that Armies had once marched from here into that deep cold Russian tundra . From which a few years later armies would return flooding this city like the snow itself.

As I passed along thickly snow padded pavements the roads and the rules of the world began to disappear. The machines, the trams and traffic grew slower and slower as mankind was honourably subdued by nature. Something deep and rhythmic in the seasons of life was restored. And then, quite suddenly my faith in the benevolence of coincidences was affirmed. Lifting my gaze from the strange orange and purple hues of store lights on the snow in front of me I stumbled across a flower shop. Considering for a moment in the snow, I seized the opportunity to bring fresh roses into my home after negotiating with the asian shopkeep through the glass with finger pointing and not a single comprehensible word exchanged.

As I sit now at my kitchen table with this white rose in front of me, I know that this will be a day to remember.

To create art is a healing process. To transform struggle and suffering into beauty affirms life. Participating in some small measure in the beautifying of being, attuning to the rhythm of the Moment and the gathering of things: this is the dialogos of the artist.

The body of the artist may suffer greatly and yet, in his being that instrument, his suffering is redeemed. To be like the medieval stone mason who piously laboured for decades in the birthing of a Cathedral that will never be completed in his lifetime. There is something in this for us. The call to a vessel or an ark that bears us through time by virtue of being beyond any single generation. What would it be to find beauty, dignity and sacredness in one’s work and being? To be and be towards...What Cathedrals might we build together and envision? Not of stone but of speech, of music, of our hearts and our minds, with the devotion of our living in the world. Could we, in all this—in being all in—let it all go? To labour and love in the knowledge that all form must die and change and that our greatest loves and enterprises will ultimately disappear into that horizon.