Transcript Below

eugene: [00:00:00] Relax. Which episode

is this?

Kuan Yew: If it's spirit versus science, it's probably six. Probably. So there's a

eugene: statistic on Spotify that said most, 75 percent of podcasters don't survive past 10

Kuan Yew: episodes. So you're halfway to

eugene: 10. Once you break that 10, you're not part of the statistic anymore. And then the next part is to hit the first 50, the first hundred.

Kuan Yew: Cool, cool, cool. In my, in my channel, I have The Spirit Versus Science. Yeah. And I have The Holistic Human. Mm. So, Holistic Human deals with entrepreneurship education. Yeah. And recently, health. I did one on burnout last Saturday. Wow. Yeah. I think most Singaporeans

eugene: need to hear that. Mm hmm. Because there's so much talk on mental well being.

Right. Mm. Okay. Where do we start? This is [00:01:00] Spirit vs. Science by Dr. Kuan Yew, and I'm just a guest, guest, special guest, and also a guest host for this show using my plays and my equipment as the set and backdrop, which thank you very much for, for, for, you know having me in mind for your show. We've talked, we've talked about various topics regarding Spirit vs.

Science throughout, over lunch, and I'm So happy to see that. This is the sixth episode. Yes.

Kuan Yew: Yes. Going strong. Yes. It couldn't have been possible without your encouragement and your support.

eugene: Thank you. Thank you. All the hard work and heavy lifting is by you. And also now that you are working for a company, I'm not sure if you can mention a name, but you're in charge of wellness.

Yes. Yes. So tell us a bit

Kuan Yew: more about that. So wellness is I would say that The view of wellness, there is a spectrum from, on the left hand, if we see it as a bell curve on the left hand is where people have mental illness or physical illness. A lot of some people do not fall into that. They [00:02:00] are not on medication or anything, but they are languishing, meaning they probably have to drag themselves out of bed every day.

They trudge through life, unhappy and unfulfilled. Beyond that, there is the moderately well, where they are actually managing and coping. Going through life, not burdened by much, but then they are not actually thriving, they are not flourishing. They don't feel enlivened by what they do. They don't feel the value and impact of what they do.

It's just like, you know, paycheck to paycheck, month end to month end. And then life just goes on like that.

eugene: That's actually most

Kuan Yew: people. Yeah. And what I believe well being is, is that everyone deserves to be thriving and flourishing at the extreme right hand side. And that's what wellness to me means. Yes.

So that's the

eugene: ideal goal, flourishing, wellness, not living paycheck to paycheck, having a quality life and quality life doesn't just mean being able to afford luxuries, being able to have freedom of mind, not being stressed out, burdened, and in that [00:03:00] loop, endless loop where you feel like you're an hamster

Kuan Yew: on a wheel.

Yes, hamster on a wheel, exactly, exactly.

eugene: That's all great, you know, Kuan Yew, but how is that related to spiritual side?

Kuan Yew: Ah, I see. When does that connection happens for you? Okay. So if we look at WHO, like, World Health Organization's definition of well being, well being is not just the absence of illness, but it also incorporates mental, emotional, and social well being.

Huh. And how does it relate to spirit versus science? Well, I'm a spiritual person by necessity because of the things I went through, because of my quarter life crisis that I experienced, and it plunged me into this journey, and then that's how I met you also. So, and to me, spirituality Gives us a few very important components of well being.

It gives us peace of mind. It gives us a sense of purpose. It gives us a connection between knowing yourself, being connected to others around you, connected to the world, and even to the cosmos. And that's where intrinsic joy [00:04:00] actually comes from. You, your, your happiness is not secondary to whether it's a possession, or a purchase, or a...

You know, a holiday trip, but it's just like, it comes from within. That's what spiritually can bring to someone. And to have that, right, you are not endlessly pursuing something because your joy and your happiness comes from within.

eugene: Isn't that in conflict with a lot of your peers in the science faculty?

Cause what you just said, I totally subscribe to that, but I'm not in a medical field. I'm more in what people would call in the, the pseudoscience side of life, you know, Palo Santo ing, the smoking, the incest, the singing bowl. So when I talk about spirituality in my circle, it's readily welcome to people to my demographic who understands that.

But how do you reconcile that with people, your peers who are very much into science, facts, details, and then we start talking about the soul, something that's intangible, unquantifiable. Yes. Does [00:05:00] that not put you into conflict with your peers?

Kuan Yew: Indeed you are right and to be honest, stepping out into what I'm doing now is really not easy.

I always have that thought in my mind that build me a bonkers or things like that. That's a, that's a usual theme that I have to contend with. So what I personally done along the journey is that not only am I a medical doctor, I have also training in internal medicine in the form of The, I'm a member of the Royal College of Physicians United Kingdom, and I also have a diploma in advance.

I, I wouldn't say advance diploma in family medicine in Singapore. So I have go rather in depth or breath in that direction. At the same time I have training acupuncture back in Malaysia. Mm. And I'm also a ana meditator and I practice Sorin Cream, Qigong also. Wow. And I also train in hypnotherapy.

And I was a hypnobirthing instructor previously lah. So it's [00:06:00] not just on a whim that I state the things that I say, but it's actually through what I learn, from both ends, the East, the West, and then the the subconscious part of things. So yeah, it's... And then my personal experiences, which I cannot deny.

And it's because of all this, it shaped my worldview. And therefore, it may not be true for some people, but it is true for me, and I stand by what I say, and then it is backed by experience, and then I try to ground everything I say in science and evidence based medicine, and that hopefully that brings it more, give it a more palpable feel, more tangible as far as I can.

eugene: Dr. Kuan Yew, ladies and gentlemen, very impressive list of Achievements and experience if you want to find out more about the experience that he talked about with regards to his midlife crisis and Seeing things that cannot be explained go to supernatural [00:07:00] confessions YouTube channel and look for his face on one of the videos I think it's about Experiences in what's title?

Yeah, okay, we'll put the link in the video somewhere somewhere below and above So clearly you are not A noob when it comes to topics on both sides. And I think what you're trying to do is to find a nice middle ground to substantiate a lot of this unquantifiable experience with some form of proof. Yes.

So that's where you, that's where spirit versus signs come in, that middle of meeting ground. Correct. Wow. Correct. Beautiful. So today we're going to be talking about death.

Yes.

eugene: Okay. It is a very serious topic. Oh. Also it's a topic that's very close to my heart. Not many people know about this. I'm gonna share this with you.

Mm-Hmm. On my signature. If you know, if you bought my book and I signed the book for you, you realize that my t my t the surname. Mm-Hmm. is an

Kuan Yew: Oh,

eugene: I see what that's, that's a circle on top. It's an an ah, [00:08:00] because from a young age, I've been fascinated with immortality 'cause I've been afraid. I'm afraid to die.

I don't want to die. If I can live forever, I would choose that. Some people say, oh, immortality is a curse. No, I want to be able to live through the generations. I want, I don't want to die. I don't want to know what's on the other side. May it be good or bad. The idea of heaven doesn't really entice me. The idea of hell Do I really fear it?

You know, as, as I should? No, I always joke that when I go into a church, I might burst into flames and I'll see my friends in hell because we have like a plot of land ready for us. You know, it's all joke, but when it comes to dying and I have seen people dying before, it's not pleasant. They struggle or even when they pass in their sleep.

Now, I kind of wonder because Everybody would have a dream, [00:09:00] have a purpose, like I'm gonna wake up tomorrow, I'm gonna do this. And imagine you don't. Or, you know, if you spend the whole day at work, you know, you have grinded yourself the whole day, and now you just want to go home, kick off your shoes and watch a show on streaming, and then something happens to you, and it ends your life.

So, the idea of death has always been a very appalling topic for me. Then the other end of the spectrum, because now I have, I'm in the, you know, the whole supernatural industry, the spiritual industry, and I believe in ghosts, I believe in the afterlife, I believe in reincarnation. It doesn't look very pretty.

For most of us, how many of us can say we are saint, that we are going to ascend and live this samsara or go to nirvana or heaven or what have you. And then there's also the other thought where if you can't let go, like me, who just confessed I can't let go, would I then be a wandering spirit stuck to this earth, anchored [00:10:00] to this plane for all eternity.

So everything about death isn't pleasant and today we're going to have this discussion. And I'm going to let you lead it because I have so much to talk about. I don't even know where to start. So please just ask me anything you want.

Kuan Yew: Okay. I think before we go into property topper, just a disclaimer.

that all the talk all the opinions are of my own only. It has no affiliations with any organizations that I'm affiliated with. This is just purely my personal opinion. Second thing is any opinions stated here is not medical advice. It is just purely for discussion sake. Yeah, if you have any problems that we may bring up during discussion do seek a medical health professional.

Yeah, and, yep. Okay,

eugene: very good. The TLDR version, don't blame him. Okay, it's just all his opinion, not professional science or endorsed Okay Where do we begin

Kuan Yew: about death? Where do we begin about death? From what [00:11:00] you mentioned just now, right, that death can be like scary because people fear the unknown.

What's going to happen after death? Religious people may subscribe to beliefs from from their religions But, as you mentioned, it may not look pretty. There is trajectory, there is where you'll be weighed for your sins, and then there's possibility you'll be, you'll spend the rest of eternity being punished.

Yeah. And that's, I think, where fear comes from. Secondary is fear comes from even the, the media that we consume. We see that, oh, death is painful. If your heart stops, the doctor will jump in and give you electric shocks. And then they're going to poke things into your nose, into your mouth, into your everywhere.

And then that process is traumatizing even to look at. However, I think we have really stepped some distance away from how death used to be or should be, just like birth. Birth is a social [00:12:00] event. If you look at the entire animal kingdom, no animals, when they give birth, like, Crying, screaming, kicking and saying that push, push somebody holding the hand, you know, shouting Push, push, push, push, push, your hand is almost there what actually happens is the animals, they will go quietly, go to a corner somewhere dark And then before you know it, a little of kittens or puppies are out And when I understand hypnobirthing, I think that's how Birth should be a social event, full of love, warmth, affection, calm.

Not with machines beeping, with, like, people shouting you, you know, PUSH! PUSH! PUSH! PUSH! PUSH! Like the drama mixes, and then it's like, oh, PUSH! So painful! I need, I need Antonov's, which is the gas, I need patadine injection, I need epidural, and then and then eventually go into caesarean because of there's so much fear behind the thing.

Death in... iN similarity, is that death should be a social event. Yeah. [00:13:00] It has to be a flashing green.

eugene: I think one of my card is, SD card is faulty. You

Kuan Yew: see, or it could be just , Electronic devices do mal function around me. , of course, we are talking about such topics there. Yeah. But the last time the, the thing fell, right? Yeah. Then I dunno whether I told you, like the Fitbit, right? Ah, the baseline charge is four and a half days.

, after I went in once it went to six days then seven and a half days, and now the battery lasts 10 days.

eugene: Yes. So you're saying about birthing . And it should not be that way because you went with the, the machines will go in BP, the lights will go in there.

Someone shouting, push, push, push, push. And you said you believe something else.

Kuan Yew: Okay. So to elaborate on that what I would say is that. Birth is rest and relax process like digestion. It's where the parasympathetic end of things, rest, relax, digest. And when you are in fear you are in sympathetic mode.

So you [00:14:00] fight, freeze and fight. And these two are in disparity against each other. I want to relax so that I can give birth gently, so that my cervix, my uterine canal can relax so the baby comes out easily. But because of the unfamiliar environment, beeping sounds, people shouting, you hear next door, there's a lot of fear.

Fear comes like your body goes into fight or flight. All things that should relax, the muscles that should relax becomes tense. That's where the pain and discomfort comes from. In a very relaxed birth, they actually feel tightness and stretching, but it's not actually pain pain. It's the fear that makes things more difficult.

Yeah, I probably went too much into hymnal burning. Yeah, let's go back to that. Okay, okay, okay.

eugene: Yeah. But one of, some of the things that your fans love about watching your radio is the fact that you really go science into it. There may be not many words that we understand, but definitely sounds really legit.

Okay, so hypno birthing. That's what it [00:15:00] is. So To summarize what I understand about what you just said The modern way of giving birth seems to be counterintuitive to what nature has prepared for us Where you're supposed to just, like if you look at the animal kingdom, you just go to one quiet corner, relax, and then You know, let it, let nature takes its own course Except that right now we have the teet teet teet with the doctors in the past, right?

Injection! This, this, this, right? Yes. So but what has birth got to do with that? I mean, in the cycle of it, I understand. How does it connect it

Kuan Yew: for you? Ah, I see. Birth should be a social event 90 percent of the time. Yeah. Death should be that as well. Yeah. When you are in the hospital, um, when there is no pre phase, like an advanced care planning or something, Then doctors are it's their duty to, to help you prolong your life.

And that's where the intervention comes in. We'll probably talk about advanced care planning subsequently. If this happens at [00:16:00] home, what happens is you call a family doctor to come to visit. And if the doctor thinks that there's no foul play, then he'll sign a certificate of cause of death.

That enables a family member to get a bureau certificate. Yeah. If the doctor comes and suspects like he's unnatural, then they'll get the police involved. So typically at home if that happens at home, it should be a family affair. There is not a lot of, you know a lot of intervention, A lot of how would say equipment involved and.

That is how I would say a peaceful death at home, that can be what it is and it is not so dramatized in films, you know people death trolls in the bed death gurgles, or a lot, a lot of like different connotations that makes it, you know, , even thinking about it causes fear and uncertainty.

Yeah.

eugene: Yeah. So there's none of the struggles. No. So I understand birth. Most births will be quite [00:17:00] in the same vein because you would know when you're going to pop. You know, your water bag will burst, there will be signs. But not death. Unless you're terminal, you're given a finite amount of time. Most death just hits you.

Accidents. Even old age fit people getting heart attack, old people getting heart attack when there's no prior signs, a fall down the stairs. So, death, you can't prepare for death like you could in birth. It'd be nice to have everyone around you and like, have that kumbaya moment, as you, as you fade away.

But not many people have that kind of luxury.

Kuan Yew: Maybe I can share here is like my, my, my dad his own passing he was admitted to the hospital. He had breathing difficulties. He was on high flow oxygen. He had atrial fibrillation, which is the arrhythmia, the heart beat is unstable. And knowing his prior conditions, he had lung [00:18:00] conditions, he had heart conditions.

Doctors say that there's probably only this much we can do. Would you want to take care of him at home instead? So we brought him home. And this is where the kumbaya moment comes, where we inform all the friends and family. And then, what we Chinese believe is that usually the elderly people, right, they'll wait until everyone is here.

Then only they take their final breath. And indeed that is what happened. So my second brother fill in from Australia. Then when everyone is ready maybe about, , half a day later, he breathed his last. Yeah hmm.

eugene: From My understanding, patients who are about to take their last breath, they're about to die, somehow miraculously, 24 hours prior, they seem to be very healthy, high spirits, and then they suddenly they go.

Is that just a superstition or is that something that you see in a professional field happen more time

Kuan Yew: [00:19:00] than it should? Okay. In, in Chinese, we call this 回光返照, where they are very, very lucid. Initially I thought it's like probably something that we, we think is our, just our beliefs. But when I wrote my latest newsletter on death, when I looked through the literature, it's actually this lucidity moment is documented in doctors who are in ICU.

They actually, They study what happens to the brain during the process of death. They were studying near death experiences and things like that, and they noticed that this moment of lucidity is actually I wouldn't say very, very common, but it's, I would say maybe yeah, plucking the number out of the air is about 25%, so it's not that uncommon.

Yeah. Okay,

eugene: so there is a science backed into that, but did you figure out why it happened?

Kuan Yew: Yeah. Why did it happen? Because

eugene: that doesn't sound like part of the sick person's journey. Like you don't suddenly just have a, have a reversal.

Kuan Yew: So why is that? One part, I don't have a straight answer, but one part may be related [00:20:00] is that when they place EEGs, which is the electroencephalogram checking your brainwaves, they find that probably in like advanced meditators, they have a gamma brainwave, which is a very, very, You think brainwaves, you and me talking now, we are at alpha when we meditate, when we transition between sleep, we're in sorry, currently we're in beta.

When we transition in between sleep, when you're meditating, we're at alpha. We want to go to delta, even gamma, gamma is reached by very advanced meditators. And then when they place ECGs on people who are near death, right, the, initially the brainwaves may be jumbled from all their conditions that may have.

But at the moment leading towards death, the few minutes or hours, the EEG pattern, some of them will have demonstrate gamma activity and it is actually is linked to transcendental moments. Yeah. And I think there is some correlation between the lucidity and, and this phenomenon, although I'm still in the process of like researching.

So I haven't [00:21:00] got a full answer yet.

eugene: Yes. Well, so speaking of death and speaking of. different brainwaves. There are a group of people who can meditate themself into ascension. What do you call it? Samadhi? I think that's the word. Samadhi, yes. And is that a form of suicide? Because suicide will be taking your own life.

Samadhi is the act of understanding that you could ascend past the human body into a higher realm, leaving this shell and vessel behind. Okay, so I've been in India where there is a Samadhi ashram. People from anywhere in the world would travel down and make preparations for their burial. They will go into any, it's like, we say it's an ashram but it's actually more like a small hut with an open space with a lot of trees.

You pick a tree you want, you go underneath and you just meditate. You never wake up from meditation. And [00:22:00] these are people, I'm not even talking about them taking in med, Drugs taking your life in any unnatural way. It's purely meditation, ascent to ascent. Have you heard of that before? And how does, Oh,

Kuan Yew: what's your take on that?

My take on that is that what I understand in Samadhi is this is a state like Bangga is a state of Vipassana meditation where you feel you lose yourself and you are you, you meld into your surroundings. Samadhi is also a state of mind. Where you reach it and you can come back, but I didn't know that this is a form of where they choose.

Yeah Yeah, and I didn't know about that. Yeah,

eugene: it's not even some very senior monks They would be the meditative state at the end of this and you can foretell things like, okay There'll be there'll be some signs where you can bury my body So that that crosses from death into the different realm and we are now looking at Death by choice or death by supernatural means.

Does that make you [00:23:00] uncomfortable? Or how does a doctor look at the topic of death beyond the idea of what we just talked about with regards to dying in hospital or dying in

Kuan Yew: the bed? With this let me broaden the thing slightly. So I think in Netherlands is the place where Is it the only place in the world let's check on that, where you can actually choose your death.

In, in this instance, from what you mentioned, is that whether it's like pro choice or pro birth, like, like like the choice of whether to give birth and, and abortion, right? Like euthanasia also, right? Yeah yeah, euthanasia, when you talk about death, and by then talking about birth is like do we support abortion, which is also a very, very big topic also.

So, can we apply that? That, that thinking frame to this one. Can, if I can choose whether or not to give a baby, can I choose my death? This is a very controversial topic. Yeah. Actually quite hard for me to tread. I would say that if the person has premonitions of[00:24:00] what is going to come and he can make preparations for it, he can inform his family members, he can settle his worldly affairs.

I would say that is actually a good way to go rather than, you know, leaving things unsettled whether it's family finances, debts, people being left untold about things. Yeah, that may be a better

eugene: way. For sure. Now that you mentioned about that, I have people I know whose loved one passed away and they aren't able to carry on with life.

Already they are grieving. But it's not just the loss of a loved one that caused them the greatest problem. It's the social part of things like the bank Yes, the house, the licensings, a lot of things require administration. Yes, and then she went to the bank Like yeah, that's my husband. Oh, we need signature.

He's dead. You know, so sometimes they can be very insensitive with their responses So if you ask me do I want to be able to prepare to go I think [00:25:00] that'd be ideal. But many of us take life for granted. Like, technically, all of us could go tomorrow. Yes. Like, not to be foul mouthed, but touchwood. We have our podcast here this morning.

Anything could happen to either one of us in the afternoon. Yeah, true. How prepared are we in that instance? I will tell you, I'm ill prepared. Like, my passwords, my my Bitcoin wallet and everything you know, has not been properly Passed on or there is no system for the loved one to take over anything.

Yeah, and I think we all most of us take that for granted

Kuan Yew: Indeed indeed my wife has been On and off you bring it up. You know that you must nominate your insurance You must nominate your CPF and get your affairs in order because let's not take for granted that we'll be here tomorrow Yeah, yeah, and yeah, it like you say it's best to be prepared.

Are you prepared? on the Individual, personal level I would say that if I were to leave suddenly in the [00:26:00] next 24 hours, I would say I live my life without regrets. Wow. That is one thing that I can, like, guarantee say. Yes. But my wife would say that, no, but you leave so much mess behind. That's a separate side of things.

But on a personal individual level, I felt that I, through the pain I went through, I, I, I found my meaning, my purpose, and currently I'm living it. And so that even if I were to die in the next 24 hours, I have no regrets.

eugene: That is an enormous achievement as a human being to be able to say I live and I live without regrets.

How old are you? 36. 36! 36 years old living without regrets! I'm not ready. I'm not ready. I would struggle to leave. I have a lot of unfinished business I feel. Tough, man. Even talking about the topic of death makes me think about death. And the minute I start thinking about death, it gets me very squamish about it.

So, yeah. Yeah. I'll try [00:27:00] to throw the

Kuan Yew: ball into your court there. You know, you've been in this supernatural arena for quite a while now. How has it shaped your view of them?

eugene: Oh my god, that's a good

Kuan Yew: question. Yeah, that's going to be a deep rabbit hole and I can't wait.

eugene: How did it shape my view of them? It got me thinking, on the positive side, it got me being very compassionate.

That's the biggest difference that I feel within me. While I used to... do things because I feel like it. And most times it's, it's on the spur of the moment or like someone messes up your day. You, you, you react with anger, right? You will snap at a person and it's pretty much natural for us. We walk into the crowd at MIT, someone step on our feet and we go, Hey, you know, that's, that's that outburst.

I'm pretty much just like that before. And I [00:28:00] always believe in shooting off my mouth, being my authentic self, being authentic means being free with your, You know, your opinions, you know, but now knowing that believing my own personal belief that there is a life after death that may be a lot longer in timeline than this human shell of ours.

70 years as a living person, but there may be 300 years as a soul before your purgatory, before everything else, then then the reincarnation and there could be many lifetimes. So my exact. Point of survival in this timeline is a blip. And this blip, every little blip along this timeline makes a big difference to where I will be.

That makes me look at life in a very different way. I became a lot more patient. I became a lot more compassionate. I take things a lot less harsh. [00:29:00] The biggest change is from within, how I treat myself and then from within it moves outwards. So I'm more kind to myself. I allow myself a lot of forgiveness.

I find myself to be able to shrug a lot of things off. And because I was able to do that from within, I can now, if I meet someone and train to step my feet, shrug. You know, it's no big deal compared to the greater scheme of life. Yes. Yes. And once I had that understanding then the next part of the Awareness comes in that I have to pay for a lot of what I do now in future karma or sins of the father Depending on which religious background you're from then you start to live your life Differently today because you're putting in savings for tomorrow.

You know, you're not trying to get your paycheck today, living off the paycheck this month. You're like, [00:30:00] I need to put aside some money for future events. And the what ifs and insurance. So I would like to think that in however remaining years I have left in this very short timeline I have, I would make a big difference in my afterlife.

So, being in a supernatural world, Makes me believe in afterlife, and then it changes my behavior in this life

Kuan Yew: right now. Mm, I see. I, I, I concur with that in the sense that because of the personal pain that I went through, and then I also used to have emotion blocks. I don't know what is happening inside, and I'll just flare up out of sudden.

It took me like one year plus to, to, to really step back from reacting and going to response. And the stance that I hold now is that If we imagine anyone on the street, anyone you meet on the street everyone carries a backpack. The backpack is carried with their their regrets what they went through yesterday, what happened [00:31:00] this morning, whether they had a quarrel with the husband, with their children, there was a unhappy parting when they leave the house.

We don't know what they are going through. And each one carries a backpack, we don't know how heavy it is or how light it is. And then, can we just spare, and I carry a backpack of my own. If I commit a fupa along the way, would people give me, spare me some empathy to say that he might have a bad morning?

He got out of the wrong side of bed this morning. Can you spare a little bit of empathy for me? And with that in mind, I, I start to see people on, on the street carrying a backpack and then when everything happens, I give them benefit of the doubt. I give them some leeway to, to breathe that, you know, he had a bad day.

Let's give him some slack. Yeah, and I want to

eugene: share a story with you. Yeah true story. Yep This happened about I think the month of July perhaps. Yeah Strangely enough I was going for a basic meditation course in a temple in Tanah Merah [00:32:00] I usually on Friday Night Live, I would sleep late and Saturday morning I have to go very early for meditation.

Sometimes I'm not able to wake up in time to take a bus, so I'll take a Grab. It's quite near, it's probably under 10. So I called a Grab. The uncle got lost. And I saw on a map he was on the other side of the estate. So I said, don't worry, it's easier for me to walk over towards you than you to drive over, meander over towards me.

I walked over to where he was, he says, oh no, no, I've driven out already. I said, okay, my uncle, where are you? Cause he's still lost. He said, I want the main road. I said, you wait at the main road. I'll walk towards the bus stop. I walked towards the bus stop. He says, Oh, I found the entrance to the car park.

I said, okay. But by then I'm really hot and sweaty and bothered. I'm 10 minutes late. So that happened a few more times when we played catching. I was on the phone and I raised my voice. I shouted. I said, I'm going to stop driving. Stay where you are. You see Seng Siong, you wait at Seng Siong. I will come over towards you.

Right? I turn off the phone. Back then it would have been the equivalent of [00:33:00] slamming down the phone. But now you just, buttonless phone. You just, you know, it's not as kick ass. So when I walked towards, when I was walking towards him, I was fuming, man. I was sweating. And I told myself, I'm going to give this uncle a one star.

I'm going to journey towards where I'm going to be. I'm going to be mean and harsh towards him. He deserves this. Then another part of my brain goes Hold on a freaking minute, you're going for meditation course in a temple and you were having these thoughts and behavior like this. I felt like such a hypocrite, felt ashamed of even having those thoughts.

But the time I arrived at this grab and I was holding on to the, the, the car handle. I had a split second decision making to go in and continue being an a*****e because I'm angry and sweaty. I'm, I'm, I, I deserve this moment. Or I could just. Not do that. In that split second, I pulled open the door I decided, I'm just gonna be [00:34:00] nice.

It takes less effort to be nice than to sit in the car fuming and try to pick a fight. Being nice takes less effort. So I sat inside, I closed the door gently, that took conscious effort by the way. It's not even a game. And I turned to the uncle and I said, Uncle, we finally met! You know? And to be fair...

That entire behavior of closing the door and having that demeanor of smile and Mock joy is entirely fake, right? But they said fake it till you make it. Yes So he turned to me and he because I was smiling. I was not yelling at him. I think he felt even more apologetic Oh, I'm so sorry. I'm so sorry. That's it.

No, no, no, it's okay. No, no. No, I'm so sorry immediately I just like I cool down. Yes. So I said, Oh, don't worry, uncle. Just drive there. Don't worry. I have 10 minutes late. No difference. They're going to be meditating for one half hour anyway. Then he said, Oh, I used to go there and meditate as well. So we had a shift.

[00:35:00] And as we were going there, something just occurred to me. Like, you know, I was telling myself, well, he could have had a bad day. What you just said. So I said, Uncle, how's your day? In the next 15 minutes, he started pouring out how bad his morning was. And he was close to tears. And I sat there, I was like, Oh, I could have, in that split second, just screwed up this guy's life even more, not knowing how much I would have caused damage to him, giving him one star in his business and everything else, just to placate my own personal joy of wanting to vent it on someone.

So these are little, little things that make a big difference. And the other thing I found out is The minute I start being this compassionate, empathetic fella, I start losing people around me. Because I begin to see a difference in those I want to hang out with and those I don't want to hang out with. I get you.

And especially in today's internet environment, you have a [00:36:00] lot of people who are quick to complain, quick to whine, so negative, so toxic. And I choose not to partake in that discussion to either entertain or to solve it for someone else. Then I realize I'm saving so much more energy for myself because I am now not taking on people's burden.

I'm not sure how this is related to death, but I guess... You know, it was what we

Kuan Yew: talked about, the existence of a tangent. It's, it's a lovely, lovely story. I'm so proud of you. I'm so proud of you, really. And yeah, you, my, my, my eyes are like, you know, not to say tears are coming out, but then when there's this, every time I encounter something emotional like that, I start to feel.

My, my, my vision turns a bit hazy, yes and the smoke and I would say that it's like as if what you've done there, right? You probably it's equivalent to you meditating 10 rounds to achieve that peace of mind that you gave yourself in that moment. And that is like so awesome to be able to make that decision to, and it's difficult, you [00:37:00] know, to have those brimming emotions coming up.

You want to feel justified for your anger, righteous anger, we call it everything. And to be able to, you know. Take the other way and look at things and then make what you eventually did. I'm so proud of you.

eugene: Oh, I mean, the world need more of this, but it's tough. I took 40, I'm 44 now. 44 years into my life.

Then I figured this part out. I don't even know how to impart that to someone else. I think that's beautiful if more

Kuan Yew: people could have that. Yes, and and you're living the talk and then your people around you, your children will see what you do and you will be the role model. Yes,

eugene: hopefully. Yes. That's also a different kind of stress and burden.

Kuan Yew: Yeah. Just now you mentioned that, you know, people around you, they, they, they struggled with the the passing of loved one because of, you know, the bureaucracy behind it. And I just want to bring up that when, when death happens there is a model just that maybe some of the, your audience may be going through this just to let them know and what to anticipate.

And when [00:38:00] that happens especially those that come unannounced and very sudden People may go through different stages, , of their trying to understand, make sense of things. They may go through grief, sadness. They may go through bargaining, saying that, Why did God or the humans take that person away?

It should have been me. I have done more things. Why did you choose him? It should have been me. They can go through anger. God, I can't believe I, I prayed to you so many years and you did this to me, or whatever, or anger at God, anger at somebody else, anger at themselves. And then there are five stages.

Offhand, I can't remember the other two, but people may cycle through this stage. At one point, they may be very angry about things. At one point, they are feeling very sad. One point, they are like bargaining. And then people cycle through and if family members around that particular person who is being affected the most, hold some space for the person that This is what the person is [00:39:00] going through before eventually they reach acceptance.

Yeah, the final, eventual stage is acceptance. Sounds like

eugene: a Yoda thing.

Kuan Yew: Ooh, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering.

eugene: So where are we on death on this topic? We seem to have gone quite, quite far off. And I think because of the topic like death is so wide, it can pretty much go

Kuan Yew: anywhere, right? Yes, indeed, indeed. I

eugene: think your next topic, you're going to talk about what, afterlife?

Kuan Yew: In my newsletter, I will talk about near death experiences.

Near death experience? Yes.

eugene: Have you seen any as your medical expertise?

Kuan Yew: Let me just flip back the past 11, 12 years. I did not have anyone come back and tell me they are out of the experience. No, but I did. In my travels, I did come across a nurse. Who She was a family that I stayed with, a very very kind family.

They took me out of [00:40:00] pity because I was like Dead broke and then no place to stay and then, and then it's cold So they took me in. I stayed with them eventually about two to three weeks. On the one of the last day I stayed with them We, we went for a picnic in the car She is a very reserved person, likely an introvert.

And during my stay in her, it was just a hide and seek affair But that day or the last day when I was supposed to leave we were in a car, journey back, and then she tapped me on the shoulder. And she said that, Which means in Spanish is that, I can exit my body. Then I'm like, I, I, I, I was stunned. Then I, I didn't look at her.

I, I turned around. For a good one, two minute. Then I turn and ask her that, Why did you tell me that? Why did you tell me that? Then she said that, I don't know. I have a feeling you will understand. And, and, and that was, that was one of the pivotal moments for, for me, lah. Then it turns out that she's a nurse and then, [00:41:00] and she, she does shifts, lah.

And during the shift is, the shift is basically very, very tired, or after that, a few nights in a row. Then when there's nothing, she will lay on the, on the desk, and then she will fall asleep. And within, not sure the timeline, then she will be... At the ceiling, looking at herself. And this happened a few rounds already.

Then, after the initial awkwardness of the thing, right, then I started, like, you know, asking her a lot of questions. Wow, I didn't know this is real, man. And this one comes from a medical health professional. So there's more weight to what she says. And I said that, Damn, what do you do? What do you do, man?

If you see yourself, you know, out of body. Then she said that I would just stay next to myself. And I said that. Huh? When you, when you can go out of body, you can go out, you can fly, you can go through walls.

eugene: Such a waste.

Kuan Yew: Why did you opt to stay next to your body? She said that, I'm scared. Then, and I said that, okay.

What is the [00:42:00] longest time that you stayed next to your body without doing anything? Then she told me, this is probably not during at work, probably some other time at home, whatever. She said that six hours. She, she looked at the clock outside the body and she stayed next to her body waiting to go back in for six hours.

eugene: This would be the kind of people who would have passed away and the soul would not move on and just anchored at a spot because it's just too afraid to go anywhere else. I know someone, a personal friend of mine, a mentor, is his Dr. Joseph Guan. He went for surgery and I think he was on a hospital bed and he was...

pronounced dead, clinically dead for six minutes. And in that time, he got a body. I asked him, what do you see? He says, nothing. There's no light at the end of the tunnel, nothing at all. He, he, he was just there in the surgery room and he felt it was weird because to him, he was awake, right? He did not see the body below.

He just, he was awake. He could [00:43:00] see the doctor. He could see the nurses. He could see everyone else. And then there was a booming loud voice that says your time is not up yet. And the next thing you know, he was up. He was like, dee dee, on the front of the bed. So he was saying that, what was that split second where he could see everything?

So I said, you check with the nurses, because he could hear, as if it's, he's there. He said no, I didn't. I didn't check. So that was a moment. I said, it was such a waste. If you did, then we could really validate that you were awake, at least in your soul level during that time. Now we can't. Now it's just, it could be you hallucinating.

Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. But he said that he didn't think he was hallucinating because when he heard the booming voice of, your time is not up yet. He understood that connection with that divine voice as something that is Yeah, so I'm not going to take it away from him and say, nah, you're just imagining things.

So if you feel in your bones and your heart that that's [00:44:00] real, would I like to hear that kind of voice where I'm halfway to death and then the voice comes like, you're not ready yet. Go back. I think I would. I would.

Kuan Yew: Yeah. To this right, there is actually a medical research into this fear and then they collated people who had Heart attack, and then required resuscitation.

And then Many of them eventually passed on, but some of them, when they, I think the number was a few hundred, but in the end, the survivors were about 36. And then among them, they collated their experiences, those who are lucid, able to tell the story, and then they categorized everything. I think there are like all the versions that we probably heard of, when you die, and in, the in between, the limbo state.

relatives this relatives come to surround you. Yeah. Panel of life. My life flashing before my eyes. Mm-Hmm. . Apparently these people have such experiences and it [00:45:00] was correlated in a journal. In my next newsletter, I'll place a link to this research and then. Even in separate research for incidents like this happening to children, children who have not preconceived notions of what is going to happen to me after I die, they actually report similar things.

And there was not pre fab, you know, this information in tunnel or lighting. They didn't have prior knowledge, but that is what they experienced. So it is quite interesting what... At death, what happens next? Is it the end? I believe it's not, but what is it about? And then this is where things become very fascinating.

Yeah. Yeah.

eugene: Well, do you have a belief on that? PeRsonal opinion,

Kuan Yew: okay, guys? Yeah, personal opinion. Yeah, personal opinion. From what I experienced in my spiritual journeys, in my awakenings I think... I believe in reincarnation reincarnation, and I believe every soul that comes to this plane has a purpose to fulfill.

And if [00:46:00] you find out that you will live life with like motivation and passion and purpose, and things will, the universe It conjures things to push you in the direction you're supposed to go, things become easy and it flows. But if you are pursuing something like, you know, your own internal goals, but it's not in, it's not, how to say, it's not from the soul, but it's like mentally I want, you know, this amount of X money.

And then you, you. You doggedly go and pursue that you may face a lot of hardship and pain and at the end of the time when you achieve That you may not actually be happy. Yeah Sorry back to that. I digress. I I believe that every soul has a purpose and then we learn the lessons we need to learn during this this physical realm and The lessons will come It's whether we can see it or we can't see it.

If you can't see it, it's going [00:47:00] to be something recurring. It's going to be a pattern that you will face. Why do I keep meet such people in life? People who, you know, whether it's like jilted me the relationships didn't work out, the lessons you need to learn will occur as patterns and until you can see that pattern and you can address it and learn what you need to learn from it, it may just occur and occur.

And once you can see it, you can address it. That's when, you know, things start to, to, to turn for the better for you. Wow. Yeah.

eugene: I know I subscribe to that as well, but I think it's just, this whole life, it's such an unfair system. You want us to learn something, it's good for the soul, but yet you erase our memory every time we are reborn again, and that's, that's, that's like playing against the house and.

Your house is stacked against you. I understand how that works, I just don't like

Kuan Yew: how it works. I totally understand your perspective. It's like, somebody there is pulling strings and is like having, [00:48:00] having fun doing it. But the way I look at it is like gravity. Everyone is subjected to gravity. Like karma, there's nobody enforcing karma.

It's just the law of things. That's how I look at it. And then it takes the... This is so unfair. It's just, it's just gravity.

eugene: Do you know your purpose or have you figured out what you have to,

Kuan Yew: the lessons you have to learn? I figured out I had to like previously I mentioned, I had emotional blocks.

Then I had like a lot of beliefs about myself. I also like recently broke through imposter syndrome and things like that. But relating to my purpose, my purpose is to be the bridge between science and spirit. Wow. And that's, that, that. Thought governs everything that I do, whether it's my entire ecosystem the foundation is that.

How do I bring the gift of spirituality understanding spirituality and awareness to the masses through the things my every action. Yeah.

eugene: So this is episode six [00:49:00] of... Science versus Spirituality and you have seen Dr. Kuan Yew's Humble Beginnings in this podcast. I look forward to seeing like a hundred episode how much different you will progress then from this point.

I really am quite excited for your journey. Thank you. Thank you. So for me, I feel that my purpose is to help people. Now, I don't say that with some degree of pride. I don't want to help people. I don't go into life thinking people need help. I don't go into life thinking I'm going to waste my time helping people.

That's not my intent. Never be my agenda. But it just so happens that as I'm doing what I'm doing, as I'm doing what I'm doing, the byproduct of the sharing of knowledge, the byproduct of my connection and network seems to help people organically and [00:50:00] I would get people walk up to me on the street sometimes, go like, thank you so much for doing what you do.

Not by intent, but if people are benefiting from it, then it's a win win for me. And I think that's a big difference compared to you. I mean, you as generally people going out there wanting to do good and then trying your best to do good. But never quite hitting it. Because when we say do good, what is doing good?

Making a donation is doing good. Being nice is doing good. Doing good is so wide encompassing. When we tell someone to do good, they always go back down to, let's make donation, let's do charity. That is a part of it. But if it becomes a concerted effort, then I don't think that's something that you can maintain.

You've got to do what you do well already, and the goodness comes as a by product. You know, like, like, I mean, you in the medical field, I'm sure you have saved lives or, but to you, it's a [00:51:00] job. It's just a Tuesday afternoon, but to the person who walks away, that is a big difference for his life, right? So I think all of us have that purpose.

I believe I see the whole world as we are all interconnected, sentient beings. And as we move forward into the next few years. The connection, our psychic connection is going to get stronger and stronger and stronger. You could either be connected and grow together as a race and humanity, or you could be siloed.

And there is that pull now, if you look at society as a whole, with social media, with everyone wanting to be heard, everyone's an individual, an opinionated individual, everyone's correct, no one's wrong. We are more fragmented than ever. So... We need to form that, that bond again, I feel, and that is that war, that spiritual war.

Mm-Hmm. That we're not seeing the underlining war between the good and evil, good evils, longer, Satan versus [00:52:00] God. Mm-Hmm. is the individual versus humanity.

Kuan Yew: Mm. The collective. The collective. The collective. I, I do see Eugene as the bridge between this world and the . The other world. The, the other world.

Yeah. Well I think a lot of us. Our role is to be bridges, bridges between, you know, the, uh, whether it's science versus spirit, this world versus another world or between chasms in society. Yeah. And, and when we able to form that bridge, right, the world becomes a better place. Yeah. I like it. Yes.

Yes. And I think when the person walks up to you and say, thank you for doing what you do. I think you probably help people find closure help people have peace of mind that You know, that things will be taken care of at the other side. And I think that's very very noble too. Because there are so many lingering questions.

Because death and the afterlife is such a uh, anima it's a big anima we don't know. And then you and the other people in the field who provide [00:53:00] answers to that. It's like balm for the soul.

eugene: Oh, we have come to the one hour mark and I think we just scratched the surface of what DEF is. There's probably a lot more to talk about as we progress and discover new things.

Is there any other thing you want to talk about DEF before we, we, we close the show?

Kuan Yew: I probably just bring up something practical. Is that Advanced Care Planning is a document initiated by the Agency of Agency of Integrated Care, AIC. So Advanced Care Planning It's a document, non legally binding, but it helps family members, the patient and the healthcare personnel to be in sync in what the patient wants at the point where they lose capacity, right?

Whether they would whether they would want aggressive medical intervention, whether they would want a nasal gastric tube inserted if they are unable to feed by themselves, whether they would... Prefer to be treated in hospital at the end of days or whether they want to be brought home Usually what happens if if death occurs suddenly, right?

Yeah The and then the subject [00:54:00] being a taboo among Chinese nobody brings it up None of the family members know what are the patient's wishes and then they are caught in between the patient deteriorating patient and the medical personnel doctor will ask like Yeah, what would you like? How would you like us to proceed?

And they will be at a loss. And advanced care planning allows, you know it is a facilitated affair. You will be either with a medical professional or a medical social worker. And we will sit down and we will understand what is important to the patient. What are their values? And then how best the family as well as healthcare personnel can respect those values.

And I think that eases the mind. Of everyone, the, the patient doesn't have to go through aggressive therapy if that is not what they want. The, the patient's family will have peace of mind knowing that they have done the best for the patient. And then the doctors also feel that they are able to respect the patient's wishes and this is what we want.

eugene: 

Okay, so where can they find, [00:55:00] this will be on what, Spotify?

Kuan Yew: This will be on

eugene: YouTube YouTube. So where can they go to find your articles and

Kuan Yew: oh, I see. I have a sub stack newsletter Dr. Deep dive into divinity. com. Yeah, it's quite long. So we'll leave it in the description and My YouTube channel is called holistic human.

Yeah,

eugene: DDD doctor deep dive into divinity. Yes So, well you can find me on supernaturalconfessions. com Oh, one more thing about death. I would like to thank the patrons of Supernatural Confessions, who have voted on part of the the Patreon money that I've gotten. I'm giving 25 percent to a cause.

And the patrons have all voted, 57 percent in fact, for coffin for the destitutes. Yes. So to give them some form of... Dignity. Dignity as they live. Yes. Yeah. So again, very close to them. I think to, to [00:56:00] the community who's listening to this, deaf is very close to everyone's heart. Yes. Indeed. All right. Well, that's the end of this.

episode six podcast on deaf speed science versus spirituality with Dr. Kuan Yew, myself, Eugene Tay. We'll see you guys in the next episode. See

Kuan Yew: you. Bye.

Speaker Intros1) April, our moderator and host

Twitter: @theaprilrenee”April helps people identify what's holding them back, unlock and strengthen their innate gifts, and live a life they love. She share my soul journey in an intimate way to set an example, expand consciousness and raise the collective vibe. The vision is global well-being.”2) Marisol Pagaduan

Twitter: @solpagaduan8+ years social worker turned bodytalk practioner 2+ years3) David ChongTwitter: Chongism_

David’s Substack David had a spiritual awakening 10 years ago. He is on a journey to understand himself and the world. He hopes to be available to assist where he can4) Myself

twitter: Dr_Y_K_Ymy long story is in the about section!In this podcast we talked about •some common beliefs•How Beliefs are formed•How we fight for our limitations•Dealing with emotions •Facing our problems is the first step to Changing them•Are your beliefs serving you?•How to change your beliefs•We are all evolving

apologies that there are technical difficulties so the initial section of the discussion was not included. The recording starts midway of Marisol’s introduction.

Transcript.

Marisol

0:00:00

we might see that manifest as an allergic reaction. So that's a little bit about me and how the school of thought for body talkers.

A

April

0:00:15

Thank you, Sol and David, would you like to go now?

D

David

0:00:18

Yeah, thank you for having me on. My name is David Chong and I've been studying spirituality for about 10 years now, mostly focused on the mind and the emotional body. And just here to share my thoughts on beliefs and hopefully, you know, hope anybody out.

D

David

0:00:36

Oh yeah, that's it.

A

April

0:00:40

Thanks, David. And I'm April Sumner. I go by April Renee on Twitter. And I came from corporate. Four years ago, I had a separation from that whole world and was very disillusioned and dove very deep into self -healing.

A

April

0:01:01

I had been into self -help for 20 years before that. So it's always been kind of a hobby of mine. I'm here on Twitter just to share my journey and help others to expand their consciousness and just raise the frequency overall.

A

April

0:01:19

All right. So as I mentioned, if you have any questions or comments, you can just post it in the space. Now we'll turn it back over to KY if you want to describe limiting beliefs a little bit and their origins and give us some general examples.

A

April

0:01:39

And then we will dive into personal stories after that.

K

KY

0:01:43

Thank you, April. I'll give a brief introduction to beliefs. Henry Ford said that whether you think you can or you think you can't, you are right. Beliefs are stories that we have been telling ourselves about who we are.

K

KY

0:02:00

And an example of limiting belief would be a common one, I am not enough. A person with such a belief, usually what happens is they spend their entire lives seeking external validation. They try to rack up accolades after accolades, accomplishments after accomplishments.

K

KY

0:02:19

However, it's a destination that always seems out of reach because what they need is actually their own validation and the external validation is always in adequate for themselves. Beliefs are often intertwined with how we define ourselves as people.

K

KY

0:02:35

And that sometimes we are so trapped by our beliefs in order to keep our consistent stories, we try our best to justify why our stories are true. An example of this is like, as simple as a person says that I am so bad at remembering names.

K

KY

0:02:54

Friends and family may point out evidence and examples where they remembered names well, but they are just so caught up with their stories they deny the positive versions. And this is what happened when people turn away coaching and self -improvement opportunities.

K

KY

0:03:07

The story they tell themselves is that I will never be good at this, so why even try? Jim Quake, master of Super Brain, says that when you fight for your limitations, you get to keep them. We'll talk about when to release form.

K

KY

0:03:24

Experts believe that most beliefs are formed between ages three to 10. As children, when faced with an emotional event, they come up with reasons why an event happened. They have yet to develop coping mechanisms and a structure to understand the world.

K

KY

0:03:38

So they use stories to create an explanation for what happened, such as a four -year -old girl experiencing the divorce of her parents. She could come up with a narrative that says that if only I was better behaved, mom and dad would have stayed together.

K

KY

0:03:55

If only I woke up earlier, I could have prevented dad from leaving the house forever. If only I did not cry so much, mom would have never felt so frustrated with me and she would not have left me. As we grow, we actually acquire coping skills and a better understanding of how the world works.

K

KY

0:04:13

And we know that the blame may not be actually on us. However, the beliefs that we develop as children, they stay hidden in the subconscious and they continue to exert control on our lives. Until the day we uncover them and work at them.

K

KY

0:04:28

Yeah, that's it from me for now.

A

April

0:04:33

Okay, thank you. There are no questions yet posted to the space. So we will just move on to the personal stories. And David, if you are ready, you can go first.

D

David

0:04:50

Yeah, yeah, thank you. So I did prepare like a short story for you guys just about how the progression of my beliefs have changed over time. And led me to, I guess, where I am now. So I guess before my like quote unquote spiritual awakening, I never really like paid attention to my beliefs or like, you know, you just simply live through your beliefs, right.

D

David

0:05:14

So it's like, when you're not conscious of your beliefs or you're not, you know, questioning things, then you just embody them, right, you act them out into the world. In terms of like where I started with my beliefs, I was the type of kid who wouldn't even say thank you when I got a Christmas, a gift on Christmas. It was like, it was really bad. I didn't even have basic beliefs like gratitude.

D

David

0:05:37

And so that I mean, living like that has gotten me to or made me get to a point where all my relationships were falling apart. I was a college dropout. And then I was working at a gas station on minimum wage with like no, like I never thought about my future at all at that point. But then at one point, I thought, I'm not just going to roll over and die.

D

David

0:05:59

I'm not suicidal. I'm not going to just, you know, I can't just stop living life, right. And so that's when I started changing my beliefs and started getting into like self helpbooks and really changing my beliefs through like core simple things like developing gratitude, work ethic, like having these having these like seeds planted in my mind, like really made me think differently about my life.

D

David

0:06:23

And they're like, and so I tried entrepreneurial endeavors. I was thinking like, okay, if I want to improve myself, then I want to do something entrepreneurial and make a lot of money. But obviously making a lot of money at that point in my time or in my life was for all the wrong reasons.

D

David

0:06:40

So I tried a lot of different courses, got into 25 K and debt, and I was sweating like literally stressed out out of my mind about having to pay all this debt off. And so that's when I realized, okay, I have to change my beliefs again. And so I thought, okay, I was in this entrepreneurial mindset where school was bad and jobs are bad. But I was in 25 K and debt and I couldn't hold onto those beliefs any longer, you know, so after four tries, I was like, okay, I'm going to change my beliefs again.

D

David

0:07:07

And so I was in going to college, I finally got my bachelor's degree. Finally, like got a good career in IT, paid off the 25 K and debt. And now I like, now I'm living pretty comfortably with a lot of peace of mind. And so, but it was all a progress. It was all like, hey, I'm living a certain lifestyle, my actions are giving me these certain results. I need to change my beliefs in order to get to a better place in life.

D

David

0:07:31

And so that was like my slow progression of changing beliefs that got me to a pretty good place in life, I'd say. Maybe not monetarily super rich and successful, but definitely comfortable. And that's my little shield of beliefs.

A

April

0:07:50

Thanks, David. It's so interesting how they can just continue to change like that. Sometimes like, think you have it down. At least I do. I think I have it down. Okay, I finally got it. This is what I need to do.

A

April

0:08:03

This is what I believe. And then something comes around again and I'm like, oh, no, I guess there's still more.

D

David

0:08:12

Yeah, it's funny that we say it like limiting because it's always a progression of beliefs. It's like, as you live your life, you're going to gain more experiences and as you gain more experiences, you're going to learn different lessons and those are going to put different beliefs inside your mind, stuff like that.

D

David

0:08:30

So it's always a progress.

A

April

0:08:33

Yeah, so true. We do have a couple more listeners and I just wanted to share with everybody that this group of us speakers, we're doing this for the first time, so this is kind of like our test run in a way.

A

April

0:08:45

We're just kind of getting to know spaces and how to pull one of these off. So thank you for being here. Feel free to post any comments or questions or anything. And the next person to speak about personal beliefs would be me. And the one that I wanted to talk about today was very recent and actually it follows on to what we were just talking about David with the changing of beliefs because one really profound one that came through for me fairly recently at like another layer had to do with relationships and it had to do with unconditional love.

A

April

0:09:28

And I was dating somebody who didn't want to really talk a lot about emotions and the way that it was presented was kind of like it was like their freedom to not share what they didn't want to share, but it became sort of like a wall in a way and eventually it became clear that that was going to limit the connection.

A

April

0:10:02

And so when I broke that off, I reflected on myself and like what was I missing? How could I have been attracted to someone who was again not able to meet me in an emotional way? And the way that I went about it was dropping in with myself and connecting to my higher self for guidance.

A

April

0:10:34

And then what I received was that what I understood about unconditional love was not true. And I had always been told that my parents loved me unconditionally. And so I thought my dad loved me unconditionally, but he actually had a lot of conditions. And there was so many different things that he did to show where there was a condition.

A

April

0:11:14

So, you know, for instance, when I was like three or four years old, I had this favorite toy. It was he had told us to put our toys away and I didn't for whatever reason, I don't remember, but he got really angry.

A

April

0:11:32

And what I know of him now, I make up the story that he felt disrespected. And so he burned my favorite toy in a fire. And that was to teach me a lesson. But it to me, that's that's one example of a non loving action, but he was also violent and he would scream and stuff like that.

A

April

0:11:57

And these are all things that are not loving. And another part of it was that he didn't have an emotional connection to me. He didn't he wasn't interested in that. That would be like my mom's work. And my mom was also not interested in that.

A

April

0:12:22

It would be like, you know, here have some ice cream or something like that. So the belief that I had was about unconditional love and that, you know, my my emotions didn't really play such a big role in that. And so I didn't really understand how to connect on that level.

A

April

0:12:48

I didn't understand how to filter for that. And so that was a really profound and radical shift for me, because I was doing that with my girlfriends. I was having those kind of relationships. It just wasn't with the men, because that's not how I was really like kind of taught, I guess, to relate to them.

A

April

0:13:08

So My process is really like the self -reflective process is a process of contemplation where I drop into like a meditative state, but then I ask for guidance, I ask the question, and then I wait for a response to kind of like pop into my head and then I can sort of dive into that further.

A

April

0:13:35

And I think that's about it for me. So let's see, still no comments or questions. So I will turn it over to KY now to talk about your personal story.

D

David

0:13:54

Oh, before K -Y starts, I just want to say for that was a beautiful share. Thank you for that.

A

April

0:13:58

Oh, thank you.

K

KY

0:14:01

Yes, indeed, April, that was a beautiful sharing. I resonated with two things that you mentioned just now. Number one is that I think the me of maybe a few years ago was exactly how you describe your partner. And I now know that based on attachment theories, there are anxious attachment, avoidant attachment, and I would fulfill the avoidant attachment where emotions are uncomfortable for me, and I was never brought up to know how to deal with them.

K

KY

0:14:32

So the safest thing for me is to walk away, stone wall, that was my favorite tactic in my confrontations with my spouse. The easiest way out from being, from the discomfort of being aware of my feelings and staying in my feelings was I would run away, I would avoid, I would stone wall, and I totally resonate with that.

K

KY

0:15:01

And I totally feel you when you say that burnt your cash register, in the sense that I actually did almost the same thing to my son. There was one point I was so angry, I actually slammed his favorite sword on the ground and it got crushed into smithereens.

K

KY

0:15:23

And, but at that point, like 10 minutes later, I was like aware of the significance of what I've done, and I am aware of trauma and things that could happen. So once I calmed down, the first thing I do was I sat with him, sit eye to eye and apologize for what I did.

K

KY

0:15:43

I said that it was because I was like, in the moment, I could not control myself, but it was really a wrong thing to do. I will help him repair or even find a replacement for him. And this is his favorite toy.

K

KY

0:15:56

I know it means a lot to him. That was the wrong thing to do. And I repaired the relationship and I am grateful that I had the opportunity to repair it like immediately, within a half hour of the event.

K

KY

0:16:08

I did not want this to stay as an example of like, this is how that treats me or views me as like unimportant or he does not cherish whatever I cherish. So I'm great to be able to do that. Thank you for sharing, April. My personal story is that my personal belief was, I realized it when I was in my 27 to 28 years old of age.

K

KY

0:16:35

I find that, I'm never close to any of my colleagues. I'm not, how to say, I don't have much camaraderie. And when I go to meet strangers, they will describe me as tough, independent or like strong. I initially, I thought, oh, those are very good descriptions.

K

KY

0:16:57

But after going to sort of a seminar, we had like a group hypnotic regression session. I went back to my nine year old and I saw an event where my dad asked me to walk on the streets at night from my residential home to my shop house at 9 p .m.

K

KY

0:17:21

And I was, I was stunned. I did not know what to do because I've never walked that journey alone in daytime, let alone at night. And I would not have that to do that alone. What came up on hindsight, the story that I told myself that time was that the world is an unreliable place.

K

KY

0:17:44

I cannot depend on others for help, for safety. I can only depend on myself. And from that day onwards, I became independent. I was afraid of the dark when I was younger. And I need to have two lamps on. And I think from that day onwards, right, I slept in the dark by myself alone.

K

KY

0:18:02

I used to want company. So something shifted. And when I went through life in my secondary, uni and my work life, I carried this air of, you know, I do not need anyone. I can handle things myself.

K

KY

0:18:21

I do not need your help. And when people try to get close, I push them away. And when I realized this, I would check knowing that I had this belief after the seminar when people offered help. Even if I did not need that help, I would say that, oh, thank you.

K

KY

0:18:40

Yeah, let's see what we can do together. Or thank you for offering. I would like to hear how you would like to help out. Instead of saying, oh, no, no, no, I can do this myself, which is my user response. I shifted my response and indeed it did help the relationships that I had because people were able to get closer to me.

K

KY

0:18:57

I brought down the walls that I built around myself and myself and that really helped my relationships. Yep, that would be my story. Thank you.

A

April

0:19:12

Thank you. Do any of the other speakers want to comment on that?

D

David

0:19:21

I think it's very cool that you're able to like think back to your past and remember exactly what belief, what caused the belief and what you were thinking at the time and how that belief has clearly held through into, you know, or like how that's manifested into your life and how you became conscious of it and then actively changing it.

D

David

0:19:46

So I think it's like a really cool success story of, you know, how you went from not being able to rely on others to being able to rely on others. Yeah.

K

KY

0:19:57

Thanks, David.

A

April

0:20:00

Yes, great. Oh, go ahead, Sol.

M

Marisol

0:20:04

So KY, when did you, I guess, become conscious of it? Is there anything that was like, ooh, I need, I noticed this. How can I continue to notice it?

K

KY

0:20:18

So, sorry again, I didn't really get your question.

M

Marisol

0:20:24

So when did you start being conscious of the limiting belief? And then when did you start saying, oh, I noticed that. How do I keep noticing it?

K

KY

0:20:39

I see. I noticed after my first two years of being in the work space, I realized that I'm not really close with any of my colleagues and initially I thought it's like, oh maybe it's this company or this hospital that I'm working in that the people here behave a certain way but after I shifted my workplace like two, three, four times, the situation seems to play out the same way and I'm thankful to have the insight to say that no, the problem is not with others.

K

KY

0:21:19

If it's happening over and over and over, the problem is not with other people. The problem is actually with me. So what is wrong? And it took me like three, four years to find out. I'm lucky to have landed in that seminar that I mentioned where a lot was shared during that seminar talking about beliefs, talking about NLP, talking about finding past traumas and once I noted that, I brought my belief into awareness and then I realized that yeah, it was true when I was young.

K

KY

0:21:57

At that time, I felt vulnerable and helpless but now I'm an adult now. I have many coping strategies. I know there are people that I can trust. I find evidence that it's not so desolate that yeah, it's not a cruel world and I find examples and slowly, slowly I shifted my perspective and then I was able to accept help.

K

KY

0:22:22

I was able to change my stance.

D

David

0:22:29

Oh, sorry, but you wanna...

A

April

0:22:31

Yeah, I just wanted to comment because that's a really key identifier is when you have a repeating pattern because the common denominator there is you. If the problem keeps happening with so many other people.

D

David

0:22:49

So I don't know. Yeah, absolutely. I was going to say, the thing about beliefs is that they're largely unconscious or subconscious. It's that we're not consciously aware of them or we're not thinking about our own beliefs.

D

David

0:23:03

We just simply embody them. So whenever you're doing something, you could question it. Why am I doing this? What reason or what belief could I possibly hold for this happening? Right? And exactly like K .Y.

D

David

0:23:19

and April said, or what you guys said was, it really is. If it keeps happening, then the problem is you have to look at yourself and self -evaluate your beliefs and what you can do to change yourself in that manner.

D

David

0:23:34

I think Sol is going to go up next for her personal stories. All right?

A

April

0:23:41

Yes, that's right. Thank you.

M

Marisol

0:23:43

Wanted a quick chime in, like it's also important, right, to, once you are conscious of it, the, you know, to accept it and be like, oh wait, it is me. It has to be me. Cause like sometimes we can just completely shut that out and just continue to, you know, say that it's everybody else and play that out.

A

April

0:24:09

Oh, that's so true. When you blame the other people, then it's out of your control. And when you accept responsibility for it or for how you react to it at the very least, then you take that control back and you can create a better life for yourself.

A

April

0:24:30

OK. K, why did you have anything else to say to that or shall we move on to Sol now?

K

KY

0:24:41

I'm good, let's hear from Seoul.

A

April

0:24:43

All right.

M

Marisol

0:24:49

So something that I claim, that I've claimed for a really long time is that I'm an introvert. And that in itself is, right, it is a limiting belief. It stems, like the origin story here for me is growing up with a mom who was super active at the local church and then my dad who was in the military and we were always like in the public eye, like wherever we were.

M

Marisol

0:25:31

And it was something that was always said and reminded to me was be seen, not heard. And then there was one particular instance. It's like we were at home, it's like behind closed doors, like it was, you know, just, you know, immediate family, mom, dad, my brother, it's myself.

M

Marisol

0:25:55

And my dad, I don't know, I don't remember what action I chose to do, but my dad's response was, are you going to act this way in front of so and so, like whoever it was, like whether it was his, you know, his superiors, his bosses. And, and like as a dad, I'm just like, I'm just a kid, like I'm like, I'm playing.

M

Marisol

0:26:21

What's so, you know, wrong about, about that. And it's like, okay, I got to revert back to being seen, not heard, because being seen, not heard, is safe. That is what will save me, that will get me, you know, through the day. And that's such a limiting belief in it.

M

Marisol

0:26:43

It continues to play out in my life. And there, there are, there are some successes here. And we can sometimes look at ourselves as like onions, and like we peel back the layers, right. So in, in 2019, I finally came out of a like, really anxious and depressive mood.

M

Marisol

0:27:19

And that it, that's the year I was finally introduced, formally introduced to alternative medicine and a holistic healing. I went to so many doctors, and then one doctor was just like, I don't think anything's wrong with you. Let's just try alternative medicine, because at the time, my other options were like, let's, you know, let's do like, let's do surgery to on, let's do surgery on the brain.

M

Marisol

0:27:56

Let's, you know, take out your, your, your female organs. And that's what will help with, with your mood. And I was like, not ready to do anything evasive or and have surgery. And so I went to another doctor, got a second opinion, she's, she was like, don't think anything's wrong with you.

M

Marisol

0:28:23

Let's try alternative medicine, see where this goes. And it, it, it worked. I came off like, not only did I come off my medications, I was able to avoid those surgeries. And so that was one of my breakthroughs, because my, my, my day job, what I do, I'm a social worker.

M

Marisol

0:28:52

And so prior to the pandemic, we were doing so many, like, in home visits. And there would be days where I, I would be put in a, in a, in a different section, so that I didn't have to do a home visit because of my emotional state.

M

Marisol

0:29:13

And it just goes back to, oh, I'm an introvert, this is safe. And it's like, it's no longer safe. It's literally hindering me from doing my job, hindering me from living and living everyday life. So I found, right, so formally introduce alternative medicine. And then And then on a daily basis, just committing myself to meditation and then also in addition to breath work, also tapping, so physical tapping, bringing awareness to different parts of my body.

so that I didn't have to do a home visit because of my emotional state. And it just goes back to oh, I'm an introvert, this is safe. And it's like, it's no longer safe. It's literally hindering me from doing my job but hindering me from living and living everyday life. So I found, right, so interest formally introduced to alternative medicine, and then and then on a daily basis, just committing myself to committing myself to meditation. And then also, in addition to breath work also, like tapping.

So like physical tapping, bringing awareness to different parts of my body. Like if, if I'm feeling it in a certain part of my body, tapping that particular area, and then tapping over what what's called like, the three brains like tapping over the head, heart and gut, when we tap over the head, we're reminding the body like, hey, go check in on this area, it needs to, you know, need some help.

When we're tapping over the heart, we're letting the body know, like, hey, save, save this information so that the body can you know, better react to this later on. And then when we tap over the gut area, where it's letting the body know, like, hey, it's time to digest this information, so that we can, you know, formally deal with it

. And then, you know, move on to the next onion layer. And so, I great at this current state, I claim to be an introvert. Definitely got some way to go. But definitely some successful layers peeled back over the years. Thanks.

April

Thanks Sol. and I appreciate you sharing that in particular because of what you've gone through. Right. And so here you are stepping out and being heard. Although you're not seeing so thank you. Thank you very much. And the tapping that you're talking about? You're talking about EFT right, the Emotional Freedom Technique.Marisol

That what, it's a combination. Yes. So there's EFT. There's the, there's the Body Talk way of doing it. There. It's, it's all inclusive. And cuz it's kind of intuitive. It doesn't have you're not. It's not you're not doing it necessary to lay consciously if that makes any sense.

It's not so structured. Correct? Yep. Oh, okay. Interesting. Yeah.

David

Oh, sorry to interrupt. But I think it's a, that a concept is also really interesting. And in Qigong, and Taoism as a practice, because they do talk about the three, three main energy centers being in the awareness of the middle of your head, right? over your heart, and through the gut as your like, main power source. So yeah, I can see like, a lot of connections to a lot of different healing modalities.

And it's wonderful.

KY

if I may, ask something?

AprilPlease, shoot, go ahead.KYSo you mentioned the tapping of the head, heart and gut and when exactly other times you do that, when you are calm, or when you are in a stressful situation, or when do you, you mentioned about like, taking in information, remembering the information digesting the information? When do you actually do that,Marisol

um, as a daily practice, to kind of like, if I in the shower, because that's when I remember to do it. It only takes a couple, it only takes like a couple of minutes or less, and it just balances the whole Body, Whole Body, Mind. And then, right, that's as a daily practice. And then like when I feel particularly heavy in a certain part of my body, right? I'm going to tap over that part of the body. And then I'm going to go back and then tap over the three brains or the three energy centers.KY

I see. So it's like this awareness of ongoing things so that you integrate whatever happened in your daily life. And yeah, sounds like that.Marisol

Yes, yes. Yep, as needed and as a daily practice

just keeping it clear all the time. It's great.

APRIL

Okay, so now I think that we'd like to hear from the listeners, if anybody would like to come on and talk about beliefs or have questions. We'll leave that open, you can request to speak or post in the space and we can address it there. Questions, comments or topic for a future space that this team might speak on would be great. While we give anyone that wants to possibly participate in that way, a moment to think about it? Do any of the speakers have any final words to share or any relevant offers to share for the group?

KY

I would like to just add on like, now that we know when we are aware of a belief, how do we change that, we must remember that we are all editors of our own story.

 And the thing about beliefs is that once again, is we were young at a time, and we held that belief, because we hold a story to make meaning out of that event.

Now that we have grown, we acquire coping skills and better understanding of how the world works. We don't, we no longer need to succumb to that belief, because that was true, a particular belief may be true then, but it may no longer be true now.

And the thing is to identify them and know that what beliefs no longer serve us.

 And when we do identify a particular belief, we pay attention to our inner dialogue.

 And notice when you include statements that begin with, I always, I never, these are all indicators that this these thoughts are what we default to when we face hardship or adversity.

 We take the chance to ask if your story is really true, or is it a false truth. And if it's false, find evidence of otherwise and form a new belief, make that new belief and affirmation that you repeat to yourself whenever you face a similar situation that triggers your old belief, and a certain mode of therapy with where you talk to your inner child,  your inner child, what it does is that the belief is formed to protect you, so to protect you in the sense that when faced with a similar situation, you are protected, like what sol mentioned that “be seen not heard:, that is the safe thing to do.

And that is what we learn to keep ourselves safe.

And one of the therapy that that I went through was that I went back and saw my younger self, my inner child. And I told the younger me that thank you for protecting me, I have now grown and I am able to handle such a situation with my current skill set.

So, I thank you, and you have served me well. And the other next thing to do is, if it's like changing the belief is very hard and requires a lot of help. Seek help.

But a simple step to start off is ask yourself how the choices you make might be different if your fundamental beliefs were different. Thank you.

April

Thank you. Okay, why I did want to add on to that. I love what you said it's a tweetable. In itself. We are all editors of our own story. I don't know if you just made that up on the fly. But that is a beautiful, great wrap up. And it made me think of how difficult it is sometimes to change beliefs. And when I was talking about the one that I recently uncovered around unconditional love. I realized that that has been programmed into me so deeply. You know, your parents love you unconditionally. Your parents love you unconditionally. I mean, it's just said all the time. And I had to write a script for myself of what kind of new romantic relationship I really wanted to be in, what that would really look like and how different that would be from the quote unquote unconditional love that I had received in the past. too, and I have been reading it aloud to myself. So I can program it in a kind of like brainwashing myself, because a lot of the beliefs that we pick up are sort of brainwashed to us in a way either just repeated so often that even if sometimes you don't really believe in them at first, if something is repeated often enough, you can come to believe it just because it's been repeated so much. So I'm doing kind of the opposite, where I'm reprogramming through brainwashing myself with positive messages. And I think that's what I would, those are my final words, David, and soul, anything else from you?

DAVID

of the sea, I was thinking about a lot of like, you guys were talking. Um, I guess I wanted to say it's important to remain flexible and your beliefs, because they will evolve over time, you know, as you collect new experiences, or you start to meet new people or, you know, have more richer experiences in life. A lot of our beliefs are going to be changing over time. And not to be too, I guess, I guess, if you have the choice to not to be stuck to certain beliefs, and to just remain flexible, what would be my final words?

APRIL

That's a great point. Thank you.

Marisol

For myself, sometimes, I'm definitely stubborn. And I I want to sometimes take my little limiting beliefs and just turn them on site, like just turn them on their head and see how they are benefit. So for example, like, part of me, being an introvert, I'm, like, super scared of DMS. And so something that I started doing was voice messages. So I've been trying that out on here on on Twitter and other social spaces, it's like, it's like, instead of a DM, like, I'll just straight up send you a voice message. Cuz it's just, it's just easier. And that just came out of being, you know, so scared of doing a DM

something that you mentioned previously, so I thought about it.

KY

So you mentioned that you're an introvert, and mostly in, in the current sphere, we all think that extroverts are either one or the other leaders, they are the I know that they're the ones who control the world, or they're the better quality compared to an introvert. But being an introvert is actually a superpower. As you probably heard of the book, quiet, I think it's by Susan, or I can't remember her last name.

But what I want you to bring up is actually, we are all actually meta verts. And how do we notice that is that we behave a certain way, when we are with a certain group of people, there will be social situations when we are introverted. And there will be situations where we'd become the extrovert in that particular setting in that particular group of friends. So we are actually flexible. And we do not need to box ourselves in with either an introvert or an extrovert. We can be flexible, we can go on both ends of the scale, whenever the situation calls for it. And that brings up a lot of freedom and flexibility to our eyes. If that helps.

Sol

Yes, it does help helps my nerves. Thank you.

April

Okay, we did have one of the listeners who's already left did provide us a topic for the next time. So we'll take that offline. And I think that's it then for our first space. And thank you, everybody that spoke and thanks to the listeners that joined us. Sorry about the trouble at the very beginning. We greatly appreciate you being here. Take care of yourself and let loose of any of those limiting beliefs that you have.

Bye, guys, thank you so much April for hosting. Thank you, everyone.

Yes, thank you, April.

You're welcome. Thanks, everybody. Bye bye. Bye. Thank you.